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Author Topic: Evil Genius  (Read 34483 times)

monkey

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #210 on: August 19, 2019, 10:31:48 am »

It's so amazing a sequel is coming! After Two Point Hospital and this, I now just really need that the rumors of Startopia being remade/getting a sequel to be real.

https://www.gamingonlinux.com/articles/spacebase-startopia-is-the-next-title-from-realmforge-and-kalypso-media-coming-to-linux.14823
https://store.steampowered.com/app/840390/Spacebase_Startopia/
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monkey

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #211 on: October 19, 2020, 09:22:50 am »

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nenjin

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #212 on: October 19, 2020, 09:45:06 am »

Certainly has the right look.

Minion traits sound fun, a nice little touch.

Definitely looking forward to this.
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

nenjin

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #213 on: March 30, 2021, 05:56:40 pm »

Evil Genius 2 is out!
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

Iduno

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #214 on: March 30, 2021, 07:36:51 pm »

Evil Genius 2 is out!

I was excited until I saw it was a Steam exclusive. Hard pass.
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micelus

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #215 on: March 30, 2021, 11:08:56 pm »

Bought it out of nostalgia, yet to play it. Although, I'm not a fan of global map changes. I.e. the way money is acquired or that minions go poof after doing a mission.

The tutorial voice seems...very out of place to me tbh, and the cut scenes are VERY out of place (and look very cheap)

I'll probably enjoy it as a whole tho
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nenjin

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #216 on: March 31, 2021, 12:34:42 am »

Put about 6 or so hours into it.

Wrestled with the control scheme a bit at first, mainly because when you try to build or select your Genius or w/e, the movement keys for the camera become locked. But screen edge panning still works?

So far it more or less seems like an across the board upgrade. It looks very nice, even though some of that is purely cosmetic fluff.

It definitely feels grindier though. Money seems to flow around pretty quickly. For example, there's multiple tiers of rock to cut out of your base that you need to research for. I unlocked the second tier of rock diggery and went to expand my power plant room that was along the edge of the (previously) undiggable rock....the same space in dirt cost like $8k to $10k....this cost like $100k. And that's Tier 2 of I think 3 or 4.

Global Missions had me a little confused at first too, and to some extent still have me confused. You have jobs that consume minions, that take (so far) either 3 mins or 20-30 mins to complete, and net either $10, $15k or $20k. They generate 15 or 30 heat.

Obviously, the $10k job is just....better? You get cash faster with less heat. 30 mins in this game is a long time, especially if you're pausing all the time.

And heat, as far as I can tell, is a number that when it maxes out locks down the area so you can't do new missions or upgrade the spy network there for a few minutes. Then it resets to zero. Because this is the tutorial, I have no doubt some stuff that's supposed to happen is currently turned off. What I think happens is when you max out your heat and the area locks down, you earn a little "rep" with the Force of Justice that controls that region, driving up their response when they eventually decide to investigate you, which is probably tutorial locked at the moment.

There's also missions you can run to completely eliminate heat from that region (although not your rep with the FOJ in that region....) They range from taking like 30 seconds to complete, to 20 minutes, and cost $5k or $10k. I spent a lot of money in the early game doing this and basically offsetting my earnings, thinking that if Heat maxed out I'd have agents of justice showing up. But that doesn't seem to be the case....yet?

Missions feel weirdly balanced from a risk reward perspective. At least right now. I'm sure once missions that require specific minion types unlock that the trade offs will seem more interesting/strategic. Right now though I just cue up the fast easy money, stop paying attention to heat (since it goes up naturally over time as soon as you set up a criminal network there, which means the bar inevitably fills up at some point.) To the point I have to keep expanding my treasury (and of course unlock "item wot lets you store more money per tile.") This is on Medium difficulty and I'm still clearly mid tutorial. Like I said, money just seems to kinda slosh around in thousands here, thousands there.

The fact missions consume minions is also kind of at odds which the fact they have traits and you're supposed to seem to care about at least some of them? (I've seen traits like "Really wants to be a technician" or "fast reflexes" or "sniper shot.") But there's not a good what I can see to either decide who promotes to what via training, or who gets sent on what mission and gets eaten. Minions seem to kinda work like cash right now, everything is staggered. You don't earn $10k from a mission upon completion, you earn $10k over 3 minutes. Your minion isn't really "gone" until the mission is actually over. The game seems to fudge a lot of things in order to keep everything flowing. And that seems at odds with any sort of micromanagement of your minions. Right now I pretty much just trust that my ranks will auto refill themselves over time. I spend minions on missions, the game brings new ones in all the time. (I think every 60 seconds.) It works but F trying to identify ones worth keeping or firing.

I just got done unlocking covert operations and minions, and so far they seem about as useless as they were in the first game. After having covert operations set up, gambling tables, bars, etc...the game is still telling me the income I've earned from that is zero. Several agents have walked through the whole area and not stopped or been lured by anything, whether they flagged to distract or not. When I flagged an investigator to capture, as instructed by the tutorial, one of my workers promptly ran out into the casino and started fist fighting them, got killed, left a body which the investigator then photographed. He seemed primed to run back to the docks along with all the panicking tourists but instead decided to walk toward my base where he promptly got beat up by an actual guard.

So without having spent a whole lot of time poking it, or doing anything other than repurposing the front of the house area already provided by the game, right now the whole "covert resort to keep enemies out of your base" seems as pointless as the first game. By and large none of it ever meaningfully stopped or delayed decent enemy agents in the first game, and just gave them a bunch of your stuff to start smashing before inevitably heading into your base. I hope unlocking more stuff in the second game proves otherwise. I don't have security cameras and a lot of stuff unlocked yet. Don't even have Henchmen unlocked.

I also don't have multi-level bases unlocked yet which....man almost seems like overkill. Bases can have 5 or more levels, which is crrraazzzzyyyyy. Maybe that's why everything is so grindy and cash seems like it kinda matters more in this. There's a lot of base you can build, and no doubt end up moving things around as more space becomes available. Maybe the whole covert ops thing works better when an entire floor of your base is a disguise.

Anyways, it seems like a pretty chillaxed game so far. Looking forward to spending more time with it.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2021, 12:40:45 am by nenjin »
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

forsaken1111

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #217 on: March 31, 2021, 08:24:50 am »

I spent about 5 hours with it on stream, I really like it. They seem to have the essence of the old game but with their own twist. I have some specialized minions now but haven't yet researched the amazing future technology of Stairs so I can't build down into the lower island levels yet.
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nenjin

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #218 on: March 31, 2021, 09:18:32 am »

I'll also add that I think their voiced "cutscenes" don't add much. The humor isn't really there. TBH were it not for the implied murder, theft, carnage, I'd say it's all aimed at a much younger demographic in terms of the humor. Maybe it pays off later in the story missions or side stories or recruiting henchmen or w/e. But yeah, Maximillian's voice is kinda annoying and it doesn't do these little dialog cutscenes any favors.
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

Chiefwaffles

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #219 on: April 01, 2021, 08:32:13 pm »

I like the “cutscenes”! Sure they’re not anything fancy but the writing is nice. Though the voice acting varies WILDLY in quality. Namely the one time some one-off extra in the cutscenes was clearly talking way too close to his mic.
But overall it’s a very solid game. Feels like the first one but better and more modern.


And the trick with the cover operation is to manipulate the path agents will take and put as many distractions — ideally resolve-lowering ones in my opinion - along the path. In my experience agents tend to try to beeline towards your main base but if they see a distraction on their way they’ll probably do it for a bit first.
At this point I don’t really have any regular agents getting into my base. Only threat is super agents which are annoying. Especially the ones that spawn inside your base. That plus their insanely high stats means they pretty much just ignore traps. Any that they do encounter they just immediately deactivate and move on.

I also prefer the longer missions in the global operations map! Far better profit per minion “spent”, and requires less micromanagement.


Though one thing that stands out to me is that holy shit your minions are DELICATE. Even random agents can take down guards and mercenaries in a few hits. You have to swarm them (ideally with lots of guns) and still expect to lose a lot of minions.
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Quote from: RAM
You should really look to the wilderness for your stealth ideas, it has been doing it much longer than you have after all. Take squids for example, that ink trick works pretty well, and in water too! So you just sneak into the dam upsteam, dump several megatons of distressed squid into it, then break the dam. Boom, you suddenly have enough water-proof stealth for a whole city!

nenjin

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #220 on: April 01, 2021, 09:11:48 pm »

Based on the possible minion count, I'm sure that's the idea.
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

micelus

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #221 on: April 02, 2021, 04:26:13 am »

Main two gripes I'm having is that the trap system is very much streamlined and that the 6ish~ stats have been reduced to 3. The lack of a night/day cycle is disappointing, but too much of an annoyance.
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Do you hear that, Endra? NONE CAN STAND AGAINST THE POWER OF THE DENTAL, AHAHAHAHA!!!
You win Nakeen
Marduk is my waifu
Inanna is my husbando

JimboM12

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #222 on: April 02, 2021, 04:54:31 am »

Main two gripes I'm having is that the trap system is very much streamlined and that the 6ish~ stats have been reduced to 3. The lack of a night/day cycle is disappointing, but too much of an annoyance.

i dont mind the stats reduction: it seems to actually be 3 "primary" needs with maybe minor needs under it. because I've noticed minions with lowering smarts pop a food thinking bubble and then go to the cafeteria. so i think each of the stats correlate to an actual need. testing will be needed but they at least act like they did in the first game which is fine except for my biggest gripe:

no yellow alert. either everyone's stood down and nothing happens or everyone's spastic. so i can't have a permanent rotation of guards posted at my entrance without the alert sirens and everyone storming around the place. sure you have the armory with a table but having armed door guards was awesome in the first game and it allowed for some very great building ideas.

edit 2: welp i stand corrected, its a research option to make guard posts that guards man outside of alerts. kudos Evil Genius 2

this brings up another issue: we can't build more cover buildings. a surefire security system was to build a few shacks with max locked doors to attract agents, so they waste all their time outside trying to open locked doors and then leave when they can't or the open it and realize it wasn't worth it. made having a single or double entrance base more manageable.

in-between these two issues: no auto tagging (that i found). so agents hacking doors doesn't auto tag the whole group for capture, then cameras and speakers would summon guards from all over the base to the fight. made keeping agents out so much easier. now i'll be managing building somewhere else and theres just a random group of agents poking around my control room for no reason with no one stopping them even if they're not in disguise.

edit 3: again, its a research option to designate intruder options for certain parts of the base: distract, capture or kill. once again, i was wrong. kudos EG2

honestly the games a slight step down from the original in terms of allowing creative defensive thinking (like the old trap combos), but an upgrade in the other management portions.

edit: some more things i like, i do like that the cover casino actually does something now in that you can make some cash while distracting those pesky tourists. agents just blow right through to my secret base, which isnt fun. i also like the decor items and the fact they decrease stat degradation. i plan on eventually making some pimp rooms after i continue getting acquainted with the game.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2021, 09:47:14 am by JimboM12 »
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nenjin

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #223 on: April 02, 2021, 10:19:16 am »

Yeah the secondary items are nice. Half cosmetic, half useful. It's unclear if it just has an effect in its radius or if a minion actually has to walk over to it and interact with it.

Traps did seem like a bit of a downgrade. There's lots of movement traps now....but very few, ya know, interesting ones. I haven't read over all of them but my impression was they're just not as kooky as the first game.

Although TBH traps in the old game was basically "build 30 of them, have a super agent destroy 20 of them, bring them down with 2+ henchmen."
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

Sartain

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Re: Evil Genius
« Reply #224 on: April 02, 2021, 01:21:11 pm »

Has anyone figured out how exactly the "Scam Tourists" toggle on casino items work? It gives me money obviously, but do they then not distract agents or what? I feel like Agents still use them even if they're set to Scam but I'm not 100% on it
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