Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[FallacyofUrist]

also: person that said the thread would be locked won?  though it is unlocked now.

It was locked, but when something relevant came up later, it was unlocked.

[forsaken1111]

Always bet on the Toad.

I always bet on someone in a group taking shit too far. So far I've generally won that bet. I wonder if there is a term for the phenomenon.

[Egan_BW]

Murphy's law?

[Toady One]

also: person that said the thread would be locked won?  though it is unlocked now.

It was locked, but when something relevant came up later, it was unlocked.

Oh, I meant that I locked it for a spell just then, right before I posted that and deleted the posts.  So somebody already won the bet, unless the other video showed up first.  Unless the bet was over a permanent lock.  You'll have to adjudicate that matter among yourselves.

[Egan_BW]

But there is no permanent lock, there's always the potential for it to be unlocked. Unless it gets deleted, I guess, but then it's not exactly locked.

[Farce]

I'm still for moving dramallamas to a new thread.  I'd be able to whine about Starbound n shit.

My stances haven't changed since I last gave them either.  Pushing for a random map generator was probably what exploded the game, the total shitstorm that happened is probably why he's on silent so much, stretch goals are bad, I don't care and am still super hype for this, etc.

Somewhat relatedly, I wish the serial killer roguelike guy hadn't taken down his fakey mockup videos, they were cool to watch.

[SangerZonvolt]

Notably: The partner bailed because Josh refused to communicate with anyone. While bailing, he admitted that he'd never seen a working game - not that it never existed. There is a difference in the implications, even if for us it means the same thing.

one thing i always found curious about this particular aspect

why does anyone trust anything said by Joseph Vivolo? (Fenix or whatever his name was) He wasn't just "the partner" - he was the one who set up the company. He had equal control over all of the assets and money. There were supposedly operating out of the same city.

Of course when he bailed he'd say it was all Josh's fault and that he was just as misled as the rest of us. But why would you believe that?

Mostly because we have his word and not Joshs. Josh didnīt bother locking into the forums for almost two years now (aniversary is at the 21st of december). Fen was active till 6 months ago (I think? He deactivated his "last lock in" on his profile so I cant say for sure). Of course we made it very clear that we thought he was at fault too (which earned me a ban over there, which was later lifted when he calmed down).

Just for clarity: I didnīt kickstart, I preordered on their homepage when that was still available. So you (the general public, not the guy I quoted in specific) can shove your "you arenīt entiteled to anything".

[Damiac]

What, do you think paying money to someone in exchange for the promise of a product entitles you to that product?

You damn entitled gamer!

I'm being sarcastic... but this statement isn't as far off from what some industry people are saying...

Good to know the guy isn't asking for money anymore, I suppose no PSA was needed after all. 

[MorleyDev]

What, do you think paying money to someone in exchange for the promise of a product entitles you to that product?

You damn entitled gamer!

I'm being sarcastic... but this statement isn't as far off from what some industry people are saying...

It really depends how you view Kickstarter. If it's an "advance pre-order", then yes. If you view it as putting money for something you want to happen but doesn't have good odds of happening without that money so that it has better odds of being completed, then yeah you do accept that the money may be lost. Same rule as with a Casino, don't bet money you can't afford to lose.

Now, which one Kickstarter is intended to be, well...that's a debate for the ages Personally I've always seen it as the latter, though I do think if a project  like a game has to end before completion, then it'd be right to put out the assets and code for free so the community that still wants it can carry it on. But licenses and contracts have to be have that baked into them, not all artists/developers are comfortable with that idea...

[Fewah]

So tomorrow will decide if hes holding on to the "Weekly" videos.

[AlStar]

If I were him, I would attempt to move heaven and earth to get a video out on time - even if most of that video is him cursing as the game repeatedly crashes or something - just to show that he's really working on it.

Edit: And that he's taking his promises to his community seriously.

[nenjin]

If I were him, I would attempt to move heaven and earth to get a video out on time - even if most of that video is him cursing as the game repeatedly crashes or something - just to show that he's really working on it.

Edit: And that he's taking his promises to his community seriously.

One would think this, but honestly the time for that kind of showing was months ago. If he was willing to let important deadlines slip before with nary a word, I don't see why now would be different. He's mea culpa'd a couple times but it hasn't actually resulted in more rigor and discipline on his part.

[MorleyDev]

I understand the impulse to not do them though. Any kind of development is often a large period of little seeming to change with suddenlyeverythingchangingatsuperspeedasonethinghappensafteranother because the changes finally come together to allow that sudden shift, which is then followed by a large period of little seeming to change followed by...Well, you get the idea.

"I won't do one this week, I've mostly been refactoring and reworking systems so I can add this new feature"
"Oh I won't do one this week, I just got the new feature working and it's not quite as ready-for-show as I'd like. But first I need to work on this other part of the system so I can add those extra tweaks"
"Oh I won't do one this week, after two weeks I need a lot to show instead of just that one feature since everything else is minor tweaks."
"Oh I won't do one this week, I don't wait when did five months pass?"

There's a reason companies have dedicated PR people to manage that kind of thing: It's hard.

[IronyOwl]

It really depends how you view Kickstarter. If it's an "advance pre-order", then yes. If you view it as putting money for something you want to happen but doesn't have good odds of happening without that money so that it has better odds of being completed, then yeah you do accept that the money may be lost. Same rule as with a Casino, don't bet money you can't afford to lose.

Now, which one Kickstarter is intended to be, well...that's a debate for the ages Personally I've always seen it as the latter, though I do think if a project  like a game has to end before completion, then it'd be right to put out the assets and code for free so the community that still wants it can carry it on. But licenses and contracts have to be have that baked into them, not all artists/developers are comfortable with that idea...

A complicating factor in this is that individual projects are almost always going to insist they're basically done and a sure thing and the devs know exactly what they're doing and so on. This doesn't leave a great deal of room to then turn around and say "Oops, your risky investment didn't pay off, good thing we're adults about this."

I understand the impulse to not do them though.

For standard development, yes. For his current situation and pledge to absolutely do a weekly video to absolutely prove he's not in Mexico with everyone's money, I would think he'd just bite the bullet and put up literally anything.

[Mephansteras]

That and, if the game is where he says it at based on the last video, it could literally be "Today I talk about Madness and how that mechanic works at the moment." Show off some game footage of what madness does, show things that generate it, etc. Even if some stuff is subject to change, all he needs to do is mention that as a caveat as he talks about the mechanic.