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[forsaken1111]

I'm not trying to get you to remove anything, just explaining generally why I said what I did. You're free to use whatever mods you wish, sorry if I came across otherwise.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

I'm not trying to get you to remove anything, just explaining generally why I said what I did. You're free to use whatever mods you wish, sorry if I came across otherwise.

The amount of mods we're using lends itself to a bit of instability in all likelihood, so if one has a high level of instability, then it's probably a good idea to hold off on for now.

Edit: Holy fucking shit.  Just axed ~6 mods because they added about 2 gigs to the download.  Specifically, the Immersive Galaxy and the Beautiful Universe ones.  Holy shit man...

[Ultimuh]

So.. Humanoids is out, along with some bugfixes.

My own thoughts after fiddling around with creating new empires:
A bit disappointed by the lack of varying hairstyles, especially with the Dwarven portrait.

[micelus]

So I haven't touched Stellaris since launch and with the sale happening, now might be a good time to buy DLC. Question is, is the game considered 'good' at this point? I was never happy with the sector AI.

[umiman]

So I haven't touched Stellaris since launch and with the sale happening, now might be a good time to buy DLC. Question is, is the game considered 'good' at this point? I was never happy with the sector AI.

Sector AI works now. I still think it's pretty bare bones though robots are fun.

[micelus]

So not worth the money if you don't like robots?

[ZeroGravitas]

So not worth the money if you don't like robots?

Even if you don't really like robots specifically, Synthetic Dawn is much cheaper than Utopia and gives you access to more content - extra fallen empire and crisis, and reworked machine uprisings. It's also nice just having a few computer player machine empires in the galaxy for color, but that's a matter of taste.

[Criptfeind]

Synthetic dawn might have more content in it in some absolute sense (maybe?), but I'd like to put in a dissenting voice in, if you don't want to play as a robot empire I'm not sure there's really much in there for you. An extra crisis and reworked AI rebellion mechanics are both good, but they're compared to a whole game relatively rare and smallish in scope? The ascension perks from utopia are a large and important part of every game. Although it's true that they'll become worth less soon when the base perks are folded into the game for free with the next big update. Still, building megastructures (which I think won't be free?) (although not without their issues) are something I find quite satisfying to do, and I end up making a lot every game. (and some mods add more and cool megastructures, which is nice) and the ascension paths (also not going to be free I think?) are also a fairly satisfying thing to do at least the first time.

[ZeroGravitas]

Synthetic dawn might have more content in it in some absolute sense (maybe?), but I'd like to put in a dissenting voice in, if you don't want to play as a robot empire I'm not sure there's really much in there for you. An extra crisis and reworked AI rebellion mechanics are both good, but they're compared to a whole game relatively rare and smallish in scope? The ascension perks from utopia are a large and important part of every game. Although it's true that they'll become worth less soon when the base perks are folded into the game for free with the next big update. Still, building megastructures (which I think won't be free?) (although not without their issues) are something I find quite satisfying to do, and I end up making a lot every game. (and some mods add more and cool megastructures, which is nice) and the ascension paths (also not going to be free I think?) are also a fairly satisfying thing to do at least the first time.

Yeah, it's true that base ascension perks won't be free until the next patch. So I guess if you're interested in ascension perks for the next 2-3 months specifically, it's less important. But repairable megastructures are free now - only buildable ones are locked. So you're not missing out on them completely.

To the extent price is part of the comparison, I think that's still the main argument. Some people buy all of them immediately so it doesn't matter. But if budget is part of it, then Synthetic Dawn at half the price of Utopia seems to be winning the factor.

[Criptfeind]

Yeah. Although since Synthetic dawn is newer, Utopia goes on sale a lot more, like right now on steam, it's like 1/3 more in cost then SD, which I'd at least say it's worth that much more (if either one is worth it to the buyer of course). Especially if your not interested in playing as robots. Although of course utopia isn't worth it if you're not interested in mega-structures and ascension. Which is more or less the comparison I'd make between them.

[micelus]

Let me rephrase my question: is Stellaris at this point worth playing to such an extent that buying the gameplay DLC is worth it?

[Criptfeind]

Yeah, sorry, that was the implied question that I sorta knew you were asking but ignored it because it's a hard question.

Since you already own the game yourself, I think you're probably in the best position to make that determination yourself, by actually trying and playing the game, and then thinking, would it be worth 13 bucks to you for every time you complete a tradition you get some big bonus perk, to be able to turn all your guys into psychics or robots? To be able to build a bunch of worlds to spread yourself across to giant resource spheres? I don't know how much 13 bucks is worth to you, but I do know if you don't enjoy the base game Utopia probably won't make you enjoy it more. And probably (unless you really love robots and killing organics) Synthetic dawn won't be worth the ten they are asking for either. If you do enjoy the base game, then they COULD be worth it too you, depending how how much you expect that much money to be worth and how much you'll enjoy doing the things they let you do. For me personally, I think Utopia was worth it because I like ascending and I like building megastructures, but since I don't like playing as robots that much, SD wasn't really worth it to me. But clearly other people have different, even opposite, opinions.


Also as I went back though this thread to look at what I said in the past about this (turns out my opinion wasn't really a valid answer for this particular question, unlucky me I had to actually think for a moment to make a new answer) I saw this question by EnigmaticHat addressed to me that I missed from back when we were talking about leader lifespan which caught my eye now.

Edit: Criptfiend, WTF are you feeding those guys?  IME lifespan is *max* lifespan not average.  I can be up to the repeatable lifespan tech and still have deaths at 75, sometimes earlier.  Are you running the one planet strat and researching a new lifespan tech every 5 years?

What is IME lifespan? I don't know what that stands for, but lifespan in the game is based on a minimum, and there isn't any max (Or maybe there is a max at 8 and 1/3 years past minimum when the death chance reaches 100%? Not sure). The average is according to the wiki 5-6 years above the minimum.... I have no idea if that math is right, it feels like the average is closer to 2-3 above minimum, but idk. I have no idea how you can possibly be at repeatable lifespan tech and still have deaths at 75 unless you have both the short lived trait for that species and they are substance abusers. You start the game with almost that much lifespan, and a single lifespan increasing tech should push the minimum past that.

Spoiler: Here's a look at my leaders in the game I'm talking about (click to show/hide)

Uk-Ma was probably hired around 30 to 40 years old, and he's going to last minimally until 207, on average dying around 210. For something like 175 years of service. He's a bit of a stand out, having two lifespan extension traits (including magic space life tree maybe? I can't recall if I saw that this game or some other game) You can probably knock off 50 years off that for most of the others. 70ish for those that don't get any lifespan traits (although you can see that seven out of the nine on that screen have one). But even so, the minimal service without dying in action or to substance abuse is around 100 years, or living to about 150. I have no idea how one could have half that.

Va-Ra the admiral is probably worth noting as well, as he's only the second admiral I've ever hired and he's still going strong. He personally lead my fleet to take over around 80% of the galaxy, including beating off the crisis and two awakened fallen empires. And he's still not near death. He's certainly the posterboy for how you really don't need to replace organics that often.

[Teneb]

Criptfiend, that's in the mid-to-late game though. In the early game once a leader hits 70 you know they are about to keel over, and it costs a bunch of influence to periodically replace all your scientists until you roll for those life-extending techs. And you need that influence in the early game for colonies and outposts.

[Criptfeind]

We're talking about the mid to late game though, since he was saying even at repeatable lifespan techs he's got guys dying at 75. That doesn't even seem possible to me.

If you wanta talk about influence costs for mid game and go back to the original talk of organics vs machine empire: Sure. You'll probably have to replace some. But the hundreds you'll spend on that isn't much next to the thousands of influence you'll get from factions. [shrugs]

Also the minimal age at the start is 72... Vitality Boosters is a tier 2 tech. You sure that when a leader hits 70 you know they are about to die?

[ZeroGravitas]

you guys know theres a tooltip on the age that tells you yearly death percentage chance right