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[Happerry]

So ranged Cyclone Shield, then?  I don't want it to be sustained as I'm afraid it'll make it harder for an antimagic caster to put the spell back up if the antimagic gets out of control for a moment.  If it's someone far away, the antimagic user can keep the antimagic up while the other mage recasts it.

If it's not sustained, what's the point? They can't cast it and then actually do useful stuff so it won't be used, just like our current one. It needs to be sustained so our mage's can protect themselves and then go on and actually be useful.

Also good point on vote format Nuke

Make Gust of wind more powerful [2]: Taricus, S34N1C
Better Troop Lamellar [1]: Mardent23.
Detect Snipers [2]: Devastator, NUKE9.13
Make an Unlucky Strike spell by reversing the Lucky Strike spell

• :

Sustained Cyclone Shield [1]: Happerry

[Devastator]

So ranged Cyclone Shield, then?  I don't want it to be sustained as I'm afraid it'll make it harder for an antimagic caster to put the spell back up if the antimagic gets out of control for a moment.  If it's someone far away, the antimagic user can keep the antimagic up while the other mage recasts it.

If it's not sustained, what's the point? They can't cast it and then actually do useful stuff so it won't be used, just like our current one. It needs to be sustained so our mage's can protect themselves and then go on and actually be useful.

Because you have another mage, one behind the front line, protecting the frontline mage.  So it'll stay up just fine, and the antimagic user can concentrate on antimagic, while the one busy with cyclone shield is further back.  If it's sustained, should the antimagic wiggle a bit, the mage is now exposed and in range of enemy archers.

The exposed mage also faces the unenviable choice of having to decide to drop the antimagic or not to put up cyclone shield again, which could lead to a lot of fireballs very quickly, or an arrow to the face, and then fireballs.

With it chained each caster has one job, which is much easier to do right.  You keep the enemy mages supressed.  You cover the front mage with Cyclone Shield.

We should know how to chain stuff like that to boot, as that's how our teletalk wands work.

[Happerry]

If he's in an Anti-Magic aura he's not going to be using the Cyclone Shield anyway, because he won't need it. After all, using magic bombs in an anti-magic zone doesn't work out very well, so he can just use the Pavise Shield.

Again, without a Sustained Shield, it'll be like current choice in that our mages will have to choose between defending themselves or actually being useful on a large scale, so like now it'll basically not be used. Or if it does get relay used like you say, congratulations, you've singlehandedly taken something like 50% of our mage corps out of the line of battle, no longer using Teletalk and the like, because now they're too busy serving in the shield relay.

[Devastator]

If he's in an Anti-Magic aura he's not going to be using the Cyclone Shield anyway, because he won't need it. After all, using magic bombs in an anti-magic zone doesn't work out very well, so he can just use the Pavise Shield.

If antimagic fields trump the need for cyclone shield, (and I think that's a possibility, provided we have enough pavise shields to go around, which we.. probably could use more of.) then why are you voting for revisions of it?  Vote for revised ballistas or something.  I could go for revised ballistas.

I think that is a possibility, which is why I want Detect Sniper, as it should provide additional protection for our mages, by ensuring that we can have the Pavise Shields placed well, and help us in skirmishes.  I'd also like rev. cheaper Pavise Shields, but think the skirmish bonus of Detect Sniper would be the better of those two.  If neither of those can happen, I'll settle for ballista revisions or ranged gale shield, as that could be used offensively as well by placing it in front of enemy archer squadrons.  (fire explosive arrow into gale shield cast a few feet in front of you, get friendly-fire)  Still though, those are basically second-tier choices for me.

[Taricus]

As much as Nuke's idea has some merit, compared to just rendering their snipers ineffective it's still not good enough. And Happerry has a point; the exploding arrows need magic to blow up. A mage using anti-magic isn't going to suffer from exploding arrows. (Regular arrows is a different matter )

I'll wait until you guys get things sorted before recasting my vote though.

[Happerry]

If he's in an Anti-Magic aura he's not going to be using the Cyclone Shield anyway, because he won't need it. After all, using magic bombs in an anti-magic zone doesn't work out very well, so he can just use the Pavise Shield.

If antimagic fields trump the need for cyclone shield, (and I think that's a possibility, provided we have enough pavise shields to go around, which we.. might.) then why are you voting for revisions of it?  Vote for revised ballistas or something.  I could go for revised ballistas.

I think that is a possibility, which is why I want Detect Sniper, as it should provide additional protection for our mages, by ensuring that we can have the Pavise Shields placed well, and help us in skirmishes.

If Anti-Magic field covered everything, we'd not need any of our other spells, because no one would be able to use them and this'd just be a medieval arms race. We'd also not be having any trouble with their explosive arrows.

[Devastator]

I'm looking at a tie between a choice I like, Detect Sniper, and a choice I think is basically useless, Heavier Gust of Wind.  Changing to Sustained Gale Shield would make it between a third-tier choice of mine and one that I think is basically useless.  I'm not unwilling to compromise, but I'd like to compromise to something I think does something, not something I think is barely better than a complete blank.

Lastly, our new antimagic has to be directed.  If we don't know where the explosive arrows are coming from, it might be directed in the wrong direction.  It's not complete all-round coverage like the previous version.  Especially if the guy is trying to make sure to cover fireball casters, which is the big gain from our new spell, that it now has enough reach to get fireball casters.

[NUKE9.13]

As much as Nuke's idea has some merit, compared to just rendering their snipers ineffective it's still not good enough. And Happerry has a point; the exploding arrows need magic to blow up. A mage using anti-magic isn't going to suffer from exploding arrows. (Regular arrows is a different matter )

I'll wait until you guys get things sorted before recasting my vote though.

Your idea being we use gust of wind to set off the explosive arrows before they reach us? Problem with that is, if we don't know where the snipers are, how can we direct gust of wind at them?
If we know where the snipers are, we can just send our cavalry to flush 'em out, or aim our shields in their direction.

EDIT: Or shoot 'em with ballistae.

[Devastator]

Sustained or not, a non-ranged gale shield has explosive arrows blowing up two feet from our mages.  Right now, having arrows blow up two feet from our mages and on the other side of a Pavise Shield are incapacitating.

In order of what I would like, here's the list of things I'm willing to vote for to to get the revision through:

Revise Detect Ambush into Detect Sniper.
Revise Elite Armor to provide fuller coverage by including gloves and a full helm
Revise Pavise Shields to provide a sustained short-range magical field to trigger explosive arrows.
Revise Ballistas to be More Reliable / and or Cheaper
Revise Ballistas to be Cheaper / and or More Reliable
Revise Pavise Shields to be Cheaper
Revise Gale Shield to be castable at Range
Revise Quickened Antimagic
Revise Elite Armor to be Cheaper


-edited to include Kashyyk's suggestion.

[Kashyyk]

Quickened Tubikh Rrahim - By ensuring our mages follow all the religious tenants of an imam and even having them ordained, will ensure the purity of mind required to cast Tubikh Rrahim is maintained at all times. Thus a mage will no longer need to meditate before and after casting.

Make Gust of wind more powerful [2]: Taricus, S34N1C
Better Troop Lamellar [1]: Mardent23.
Detect Snipers [2]: Devastator, NUKE9.13
Make an Unlucky Strike spell by reversing the Lucky Strike spell []:
Sustained Cyclone Shield [1]: Happerry
Quickened Tubikh Rrahim [1]: Kashyyk

[Happerry]

Sustained or not, a non-ranged gale shield has explosive arrows blowing up two feet from our mages.  Right now, having arrows blow up two feet from our mages and on the other side of a Pavise Shield are incapacitating.

If the shield is big enough to cover a horse and a rider, then I'm pretty damn sure it's big enough to blow the arrows up on the far side of the shield, not after it hits the shield. Which is like half the point, because if it blows up before it hits the shield then it's not blowing holes in the shield and the shrapnel can just bounce off.

And even if there isn't a Pavise shield around, having them blow up any feet away from our magi is better then having them hit the magic and then explode.

[Devastator]

Sustained or not, a non-ranged gale shield has explosive arrows blowing up two feet from our mages.  Right now, having arrows blow up two feet from our mages and on the other side of a Pavise Shield are incapacitating.

If the shield is big enough to cover a horse and a rider, then I'm pretty damn sure it's big enough to blow the arrows up on the far side of the shield, not after it hits the shield. Which is like half the point, because if it blows up before it hits the shield then it's not blowing holes in the shield and the shrapnel can just bounce off.

And even if there isn't a Pavise shield around, having them blow up any feet away from our magi is better then having them hit the magic and then explode.

If it's castable from range it will still do all that.  Our antimagic spell is not cast quickly.  You can't turn it on and off like a lightbulb if your spell goes down or you get distracted.

Here's a quote from the description of our antimagic spell:

Casting still requires the mage to meditate before and afterwards, limiting them to about once a day

That mage gets one shot a day with the antimagic spell, and if the spell is dropped for any reason, you can't get it back.  Don't ask that mage to do anything else.  If that mage is to be protected with magic, let someone else do it.  Any kind of sustained spell, that's distracting, and if the antimagic goes off a bit, the "sustained" gale shield goes down.  And the antimagic caster cannot recast gale shield and then start the antimagic again, that's the one and only shot of it all day.

[Taricus]

Make Gust of wind more powerful [1]: S34N1C
Better Troop Lamellar [1]: Mardent23.
Detect Snipers [2]: Devastator, NUKE9.13
Make an Unlucky Strike spell by reversing the Lucky Strike spell []:
Sustained Cyclone Shield [1]: Happerry
Quickened Tubikh Rrahim [2]: Kashyyk, Taricus

Going cleric with our magic users? UNLEASH THE CoDZILLA!

[Devastator]

Make Gust of wind more powerful [1]: S34N1C
Better Troop Lamellar [1]: Mardent23.
Detect Snipers [1]: NUKE9.13
Make an Unlucky Strike spell by reversing the Lucky Strike spell []:
Sustained Cyclone Shield [1]: Happerry
Quickened Tubikh Rrahim [3]: Kashyyk, Taricus, Devastator

Looks like I've got no choice.  Sigh, my eighth favorite, so I guess I should be happy?

Oh well, maybe we'll Expense chit our Pavise Shields and actually get something to protect our mages?  I'm doubting it though.

[Happerry]

Sustained or not, a non-ranged gale shield has explosive arrows blowing up two feet from our mages.  Right now, having arrows blow up two feet from our mages and on the other side of a Pavise Shield are incapacitating.

If the shield is big enough to cover a horse and a rider, then I'm pretty damn sure it's big enough to blow the arrows up on the far side of the shield, not after it hits the shield. Which is like half the point, because if it blows up before it hits the shield then it's not blowing holes in the shield and the shrapnel can just bounce off.

And even if there isn't a Pavise shield around, having them blow up any feet away from our magi is better then having them hit the magic and then explode.

If it's castable from range it will still do all that.  Our antimagic spell is not cast quickly.  You can't turn it on and off like a lightbulb if your spell goes down or you get distracted.

Here's a quote from the description of our antimagic spell:

Casting still requires the mage to meditate before and afterwards, limiting them to about once a day

That mage gets one shot a day with the antimagic spell, and if the spell is dropped for any reason, you can't get it back.  Don't ask that mage to do anything else.  If that mage is to be protected with magic, let someone else do it.  Any kind of sustained spell, that's distracting, and if the antimagic goes off a bit, the "sustained" gale shield goes down.  And the antimagic caster cannot recast gale shield and then start the antimagic again, that's the one and only shot of it all day.

And, as I've said before, if a mage is covering himself with an anti-magic field he doesn't need the spell, and so like before your point is pointless. But not all magi are casting anti-magic, because we still have teletalkers, gust of wind casters, lucky strike casters, and so on and so forth, the very mages currently being turned into pincushions as soon as the enemy sees them. Of course, if they could cast Cyclone Shield on themselves and then go off to do other magics, they wouldn't need to worry about enemy archers any more...