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[TricMagic]

... Fal... Why did you use Mug on me last night? By your own admission, that would clear me from the mafiakill.

Well, other than Lidku's Attack Ball. How does two roleblocks work exactly anyway?


Thanks web! Let's see.

[TricMagic]

Hmm, idea. No Lynch means we go into another night. Fal uses Mug on Max, I use Dragon Cloak on Lenglon. No, that doesn't actually work unless mafia kills that night.

We know N1 Lidku performed an action. Fal Mugged Max, and Max could tell what Fal did and didn't die. The main point is which tells the truth, Fal or Max?

MaxinumSpin recieved no block from Fal. So, what did Max do last night? I'm wondering.

[TricMagic]

Of circumstantial evidence from day 2. I kinda got draw to accusing Lidku during my NJW post.

...Day 3 is a bit useless on the vote tracker.

[TricMagic]

Lenglon, one thing to note. Spook does not notify the target they were roleblocked. So yeah, it's useless for confirmations here, it would have just confused the issue.

[FallacyofUrist]

I got "remove an action" and "delayed 1N roleblock" left and fuck me if I know who do put that sin on.

you remove an action from FoU. FoU roleblocks + mafiakills Tric, if he's town and you happen to remove his auto, then he roleblocks+nightkills Tric. If he IS mafia, you simply weaken his abilities without changing the total number of mafiakills. If Tric has the role they say they have, then even if FoU is mafia then Tric will live because of their own roleblock. If Tric is lying, then FoU's action kills them, assuming you get the auto removed.

and the night after, if it happens, we will have to have lynched town, so you'll want to delay roleblock the last mafia to prevent the endgame nightkill, giving us a extra final day to find and kill the last scum.

I mugged TricMagic to follow the plan posted earlier here.

If that wasn't the most up to date version, I apologize.

FoU: Could you please explain why it is highly unlikely to be Max for us please?

1, I think Lidku would have behaved very differently with Max in scumchat.

2, Spin's role doesn't make much sense as mafia, I think, though this is a weaker point.


Side note, if I was mafia, why on earth would I target Maximum Spin, who claimed a hide-type ability, with my kill on Night 1, when I could have killed basically anyone else and been more productive with it? Spin confirmed Mug was used with his ability, and NJW's roleflip contains a copy of Mug so anyone can see it's not some fancy hide bypassing ability.


I don't think Spin's claimed this Night's results yet.

[Lenglon]

Side note, if I was mafia, why on earth would I target Maximum Spin, who claimed a hide-type ability, with my kill on Night 1, when I could have killed basically anyone else and been more productive with it? Spin confirmed Mug was used with his ability, and NJW's roleflip contains a copy of Mug so anyone can see it's not some fancy hide bypassing ability.


I don't think Spin's claimed this Night's results yet.

Because if his hide was a self-targeted ability then him being hit by the crane would have prevented him from targeting himself.

[FallacyofUrist]

Is that generally how hide abilities work?

[Lenglon]

Is that generally how hide abilities work?

Okay, so what do you think were the night actions each night?

[Maximum Spin]

Okay. Reading through the thread, takes more or less in order.

I had thought previously that Coming Out Alive would count FoU's mafiakills as Kill Actions, however I checked with Web during the night and apparently a Mafiakill that does not Kill does not count as a Kill action.

It's interesting that you say that, since, the very first night, the action Fallacy used on me was explicitly listed as a Kill.
It said both "Mafiakill" and "Kill", as I believe I said at the time.

My current working theory is that FoU is the last scum, that Tricmagic told the truth all game, and that on N2 when Tric bussed themselves with FoU, FoU had been attempting to roleblock Tric, and he ended up roleblocking himself.

This actually sounds mechanically very plausible, and I like how neatly it ties up the night actions. I'm annoyed to think Fallacy would have been able to convince me he was town, though.
I hid last night. I was hoping to draw the kill by announcing that I had gained a power that I was going to use, which would obviously have left me vulnerable, and I figured any relatively experienced player would have picked up on it. (The actual power I gained was just a watch, which I thought was pretty crappy under the crane circumstances. They're random from a list, it's very frustrating, I never actually got the good ones.)
One thing that I'm afraid of is this: If we lynch Tric, but Fallacy is actually scum, he has a reasonable strategy of no-killing and claiming to have roleblocked me (or just actually doing it). Since nobody else has any way to verify that, it would be impossible to know who was lying. He could also try this on Lenglon, but since Lenglon is targetable, my watch would mean I would be able to tell.

Alos, Falacy is lying, nothing happened to me last night.

As of right now, it can only be either me or Fal, I think.

Technically, it could still be Lenglon dicking us all around with a massive bus, since we don't really know what role powers are involved... there might even be something to make Fallacy's claimed roleblock on you misfire to make him look bad. I don't know how likely I think this is anymore, but far less likely than that it really is just between you and Fallacy.
I guess I want to hear more from Fallacy. The fact that you're suddenly throwing shade back on me (even if it is "very unlikely") after saying last night that I was the only one you could trust is concerning. Was that all just buddying, then? (Oh, he actually posted while I was typing. It's not very alignment-indicative to me, but I guess he's not actually pivoting on me like I thought.)

Side note, if I was mafia, why on earth would I target Maximum Spin, who claimed a hide-type ability, with my kill on Night 1, when I could have killed basically anyone else and been more productive with it? Spin confirmed Mug was used with his ability, and NJW's roleflip contains a copy of Mug so anyone can see it's not some fancy hide bypassing ability.

On top of what Lenglon said, I've also been the first nightkill after truthfully claiming a hide ability (that I just didn't use that turn) before, in the totem mafia I was in, AND I claimed commuter but chose not to commute in one of your own Marathon games which I think got me lynched or at least heavily suspected. It's not unreasonable you could've just thought I would do it again. That's why I thought baiting the kill would work this time, actually, but I guess I was just a lower-value target, probably since Shakerag was bodyguarding.

[Lenglon]

Max: I'm rapidly becoming fully convinced that it's FoU, and am considering voting him instead of Tric simply to avoid the risk of him having some way to double-kill tonight or double-vote tomorrow, but am very aware of how risky that is compared to the no-vote or lynch Tric options.

[Maximum Spin]

Max: I'm rapidly becoming fully convinced that it's FoU, and am considering voting him instead of Tric simply to avoid the risk of him having some way to double-kill tonight or double-vote tomorrow, but am very aware of how risky that is compared to the no-vote or lynch Tric options.

I definitely feel that. I think a no-lynch might be optimal, but... well, there's plenty of time so let's get as much information as possible, right?

[Lenglon]

Tric: lets pretend for the moment that Max has us all fooled, and is the final scum. Are you able to pick an ability that would prevent me from being tonight's mafiakill? It doesn't matter if you die because you can ghost-vote, but if you're the last townie standing then we lose. could you do it?

[Lenglon]

FoU: which do you think is more likely: that Max is scum that gave you whatever he gave on N1, or that Tric is scum that can bypass your roleblock?

[Lenglon]

My current thoughts on the question I just asked FoU: based on the intimidated way Lidku played all game, paired with how a godfather made him lose his last game as town, and with how most of D1 was talking about millers and inspects, and nobody claimed to have roleblocks D1, I find it hard to believe that Lidku would pick anything other than Saibamen for his N1 purchase. I also suspect that Lidku's partner LACKS most if not all of the abilities that Lidku was able to choose from using Purchase, simply because they would be clearly inferior if they are doubling up on the same abilities. As a result I personally find it more likely that Max is scum with a weird gifting mechanic than that Tric is scum that can bypass roleblocks.

[Maximum Spin]

My current thoughts on the question I just asked FoU: based on the intimidated way Lidku played all game, paired with how a godfather made him lose his last game as town, and with how most of D1 was talking about millers and inspects, and nobody claimed to have roleblocks D1, I find it hard to believe that Lidku would pick anything other than Saibamen for his N1 purchase. I also suspect that Lidku's partner LACKS most if not all of the abilities that Lidku was able to choose from using Purchase, simply because they would be clearly inferior if they are doubling up on the same abilities. As a result I personally find it more likely that Max is scum with a weird gifting mechanic than that Tric is scum that can bypass roleblocks.

I think this is a good point. Let me add one thing:
If I'm paired with Lidku, Lidku probably can't have used Purchase n1. I was confirmably hidden and untargetable n1, so I couldn't be the target unless you believe my role has an exception for a partner (since his flip clearly doesn't say it would be able to target a hiding partner); and nobody else has claimed to have received anything from it, so we should infer that nobody else was the target either.

I'm currently looking through last game's roles to see whether there are any powers that would apply. Tric usually more or less tells the truth about his role so I imagine that, even if he is scum, he's probably still using last game's powers.