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Author Topic: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?  (Read 3671 times)

AzuredreamsXT

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Please forgive my lack of pc knowledge, but most games i play seem to be installed into part of the computer (directory may be the right word, or drive, or something), they appear on the installed programs list and can be uninstalled from there.

What about Dwarf Fortress and the extras that come with the Lazy Newb Pack? I ask because when i uninstall regular games that get written onto the hardrive or however it works, i defragment the pc after to clean up the space they once took. Would defragging after removing DF and the LNP have any beneficial effect like it would uninstalling a "normal" game? Or are they just files sitting in a folder with no other connection to the computer, that runs on it's own and would not benefit from defragmentation.

I plan on playing this exclusively on my netbook now that i've found ways to keep the fps at a decent level, and plan to remove it from my bigger laptop.

Thanks in advance for information or advice
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KtosoX

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2011, 05:31:46 pm »

I'm not sure how the LNP rolls, but DF is contained in a single folder.

Edit: also, defragmentation helps when your hard drive slows down due to fragmentation. I'm not sure how running it after you remove DF could be of any major significance.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2011, 05:39:55 pm by KtosoX »
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AzuredreamsXT

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2011, 06:00:08 pm »

Can anyone comment with certainty on the Lazy Newb Pack and it's programs?
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TKGP

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2011, 06:32:56 pm »

Every program is "just files sitting in a folder", the difference with "installed" games is that they need to stick their files all over the place; DF is entirely localized, so deleting the folder deletes all of it. As far as I know Lazy Newb is also localized, and if some of its utilities leave behind some registry entries, well, I don't think you'll notice.
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Ghills

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2011, 06:36:18 pm »

The LNP is entirely localized, just like DF.  You can tell because you download a ZIP file and extract it - that means that the program doesn't depend on anything outside the ZIP file. 
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AzuredreamsXT

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #5 on: December 01, 2011, 07:05:03 pm »

So no need to defragment then, i just delete the folder, clear the recycle bin, and it's like the files never existed on my pc.
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Gnauga

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #6 on: December 01, 2011, 09:51:57 pm »

There's some finicky details. When a file is deleted, the space it occupied on your hard drive is simply marked as "free to use", and it vanishes from your directory. Any new data that is written can be written over that space, but specialized tools can recover those files provided that they haven't been extensively overwritten. Other tools can be used to wipe a file out of your computer extra-clean by overwriting it several times so that residual data is nigh impossible to collect. Not to mention registry entries for all the writing and deleting that the LNP does within itself.

But that's probably not relevant to what you're wondering.
The LNP folder is all of the LNP; nothing is scattered anywhere else. If you delete the LNP, you've deleted all of it. If you're on anywhere near a recent copy of Windows, however, defragging is automated. You shouldn't need to worry about defragging manually.
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AzuredreamsXT

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #7 on: December 01, 2011, 10:55:02 pm »

So even if i delete the LNP, residual files will be left over on my computer?
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TKGP

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #8 on: December 01, 2011, 11:50:21 pm »

That wasn't his point. Any time you delete any file on a computer, it's not technically gone, unless you go to special lengths.
Regardless, that's not really relevant to the casual user. To sum it all up: both a standard download of DF and the LNP are entirely contained within a a single folder, so you can remove them completely by deleting that. Defragmenting is not at all necessary for the situations you're describing, either.
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krenshala

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #9 on: December 02, 2011, 12:09:44 am »

So even if i delete the LNP, residual files will be left over on my computer?
when you delete a file on a computer you are actually just telling the computer to get rid of the sign that states the file is there and, as Gnauga stated, the computer can freely write to that portion of the drive because it sees it as "empty".  if you put the sign back, and the space wasn't used by something else, the file would be perfectly usable again (I've had to do this when i deleted the contents of the wrong 120Mb disk).  if you know the file is there, you can recover it.  running defrag won't really do anything unless it happens to move another file into the spot previously occupied by the deleted file(s).

if you are worried about someone seeing that the file was on the computer, just delete it then empty the recycle bin.  chances are very unlikely that someone would both want to see what was deleted and know how to do so, and if they could, you'd know it by their ability to get computers to do things that seem like magic to most people. :D
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Lemunde

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2011, 01:16:38 am »

Dwarf Fortress installs the way all programs should install. By just extracting the file to a folder. Nothing involving the program happens outside of that folder. To "uninstall", delete the folder. I don't know why Microsoft had to shove this installation nonsense down our throats.

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daggaz

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #11 on: December 02, 2011, 03:56:49 am »

Just delete the folder.  Done.  And for the future, stop running a defrag everytime you delete a single program.  Its a monumental waste of time.  The amount of filespace your average game takes up is small compared to total disk size these days, most fragmentation doesn't result from the deletion of programs anyhow, and as mentioned before, if you are running modern windows, then its pretty much automated anyhow.  If you really must, defrag every couple of weeks or so, even that is a bit overkill.   As it stands, you are probably saving a couple microseconds or less on total processing time when you defrag after removing DF.

As far as "residual files", it is absolutely nothing that impairs your system in any way.  Its just a matter of physics, and is only a problem for people with sensitive (or illegal) data on their harddrives.
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Kaleb702 Games

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2011, 12:22:48 pm »

It can harm a computer to defrag too much. Every time you uninstall a program would be designated as 'too much'. I suggest only once or twice a month.

There will not be any residual files. You should not defragment every time you uninstall something; it's usually when you install something that it fragments.
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AzuredreamsXT

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Re: Is any part of Dwarf Fortress or the Lazy Newb Pack actually installed?
« Reply #13 on: December 02, 2011, 01:10:52 pm »

Cool beans, thanks for the info fellow DF fans. This place is like a family, in an insane asylum.
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