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[Mlamlah]

Yeah, i'm not sure of the reasoning of a particular few in attempting to use our valuable gift to transform an already loyal ally. Now however, we have gifts to burn and muscles to flex, i suggest we go hunting. Perhaps we can find a suitable mate.
Also, as we hunt, attempt to speak with plants and trees for directions.
Let's umm, empty our pockets of that sand.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Damn, no navigation skill, again

But  fire magic and new gifts are coooool. And having 5 gifts while not spending one is a crime....
________________________________
Getting female night troll is quite important...  I am reasonably sure that she will not be a part of our family and will be completely independent from our will. So rape is not an option.

Currently we have two willing targets for that, Alice and the mermaid.

I like converting Alice. Of cause there are a problem with her sexual orientation, but she doesn't require to love her consorts... just let to impregnate from time to time. Also our friend deserve to get a status equal to us and choose mates as she desire
Besides I'd like to play as Alice if we gonna die

Mermaid is an underwater sub-race option, likely will have some problems with conversion but what I don't like - we know nothing about her except that she is religious and has merfolk contacts (some are religious, too.) We'll have a zealot that can get an army of zealots and divine support. More close to the the Goddess mean that Goddess will aid her more and we have a huge risk to become her servant, not vice versa

So I am voting for trying to talk Alice into becoming the second night troll.
Or we may let her choose between three new gifts (two fire ones and the last), all are good enough for her
She must understand that her father want that conversion and it should happen sooner or later... because she knows very well that upsetting her father is a bad idea

[Thecard]

UR, I'm gonna go out on a thick and sturdy limb here and assume you don't play DF adventure mode much.
Night troll consorts are just that: Night troll consorts.  Not actual night trolls.  That's a pretty big thing about them.  And our only children will be our gender, male.  That's just the way night trolls are.

[Grek]

Converting Alice is literally the worst way to use the Left Stone gift. She doesn't like men and would not have Night Troll babies. Converting the merfolk under water who already like night trolls will give the race a fall-back option in case we're ever hunted down.

That said, we should wait until our first son is born before converting anyone else. He and Gwen are the most important thing right now.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Thecard, Read updates better

Gift of the Left Stone: Can be spent to convert a female or impregnate a mate. Instead of producing a son or a consort, this gift creates a fully functional female night troll. The traits gained depends on the female converted or consort impregnated.

She doesn't like men and would not have Night Troll babies.

As I said, not liking man doesn't mean that she can't clench her teeth and let one to impregnate her. Also she is very young and may change her mind later. Also, IIRC she said that she prefers females not that sex with males is very disgusting for her

Converting the merfolk under water who already like night trolls will give the race a fall-back option in case we're ever hunted down.

She don't like night trolls, she is not loyal tyo us. She likes her Goddess and loyal to her. She will enforce her ways... Like not allowing us to be friendly with humans or enforcing any other  idiotic religious rule
We don't want  unloyal night troll   with at least equal strength to ours. Survival is important and stuff but personal power is also a goal

[Thecard]

Thecard, Read updates

FTFY.
I'm a bit loopy, I guess.  I clicked on the wrong page number.  Whoopsie-daisies!


Wait... we're balls?  Huh.  Did not see that one coming.

And... GM... if you don't mind me asking... what happened to... y'know... the rest of the manhood?  Is there some adamantium pillar out there for us to find?

[Ukrainian Ranger]

We aren't balls

WE ARE NUTS!!!!

Nocteclaw was eventually caught by Sol, the wrathful sun god, and his manhood was removed as punishment. His right stone fell to earth and became the first male night troll, His left stone fell to earth and became the first female night troll, and his rod fell to earth to become the first Glumprong tree. The once noble god became a vengeful goddess, intent on vicariously living out her lost masculinity through the actions of night trollkind and taking satisfaction in making mortals fear the night, her greatest creation.

[Thecard]

Right... I guess she wouldn't have to worry about enjoying it so much, that would be up to the man...

[Mlamlah]

Thecard, Read updates better

Gift of the Left Stone: Can be spent to convert a female or impregnate a mate. Instead of producing a son or a consort, this gift creates a fully functional female night troll. The traits gained depends on the female converted or consort impregnated.

She doesn't like men and would not have Night Troll babies.

As I said, not liking man doesn't mean that she can't clench her teeth and let one to impregnate her. Also she is very young and may change her mind later. Also, IIRC she said that she prefers females not that sex with males is very disgusting for her

Converting the merfolk under water who already like night trolls will give the race a fall-back option in case we're ever hunted down.

She don't like night trolls, she is not loyal tyo us. She likes her Goddess and loyal to her. She will enforce her ways... Like not allowing us to be friendly with humans or enforcing any other  idiotic religious rule
We don't want  unloyal night troll   with at least equal strength to ours. Survival is important and stuff but personal power is also a goal

This is a worse idea than making her our consort. If we're going to make someone a fully fledged night troll then we will want someone who's actually going to *want* to propagate the species, someone who is going to actively attempt to spread our kind through the world again, without our constant babysitting.
I do however agree with you on the side of the mermaid, she has proven useful already, but that doesn't mean we can trust her. Her loyalties may be more divided than she claims.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

This is a worse idea than making her our consort. If we're going to make someone a fully fledged night troll then we will want someone who's actually going to *want* to propagate the species, someone who is going to actively attempt to spread our kind through the world again, without our constant babysitting.

One word: instincts
Also, You overestimate effects of sexual orientation, many medieval nobles were homosexuals and had kids with their wifes.

__________________________
Reasons to talk Alice into becoming a night troll

Roleplayish
1) We consider her our friend, no other gift is truly suitable for a friend, you don't make friends dependable on you and your family. Leaving her as a weak mortal servant is not a friendly act at all.
2) We know that Foghorn expects us to turn his daughter and we view him as an ally.
3) We trust her to not use her newly gained power against us or our family

Storywise:
1) It's a matter of taste, but in case of our death I prefer to play lesbian\bisexual ranger to a priest with tail
2) I'd love to see love\hate relations between her and Gwen

Powergaming:
1) Alice knows that area quite well and will be much better hunter due to her ranger skills
2) She has a nice family, father and sisters will help her. As well as the Tigerwoman
3) She is skilled in magic and can improve in that field quite nicely, thanking to nice theoretical knowledge from her father
4) She will get along with our female consorts much better than any other night troll
5) We need reserve option in case if we die. Unborn child isn't good enough


Bonus:
Alice may consider that a nice offer because

1) She knows that her father expect that and it's better to not disappoint him
2) She'll get immortality
3) She will have only daughters
4) She may treat her "husbands" in any way she like. Up to: convert, fuck, kill
5) She will become a matriarch of a strong Night Troll branch
6) She will be less pretty (read less desirable for males)
7) She always looked at us with some awe, looks like she considers being a night troll cool (being part of harem is a totally different thing to being a real night troll)
It's unlikely that she'll ever get a gift better then that

[Weirdsound]

Please discuss hunting plans. Who/what/when/why/where/how.

Feel free to debate gift stuff as well, but I have a feeling we wont be able to come to enough of a consensious to make the decision next turn.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

I have a strong feeling that I will be the only one who thinks that we should convert Alice
Any attempt to spend a gift meets huge resistance.

As for hunting, I'd prefer to continue milking the forest retreat by patrolling around the fence and snatching the guards..., but I am afraid that we'll lose opportunity to raid the necromancer or get the noble elven... Still son is more important

[Mlamlah]

Believe me when i say i do not overestimate the effects of sexual orientation. Sex with someone you are not attracted to is revolting at best, and the only reason that anyone in a medieval era bore children through such a disgusting act did so only because of the enormous societal pressure and because it was *absolutely* expected of them, even with that, many homosexual men in particular lived with the stigma of not bearing children rather than have sex with a woman.

Response to numbers
1) She is not weak, nor incompetent, she is capable and useful as is.
2) While i think that we should keep him as an ally, i do not believe that we should do things just because he wants us to.
3) She's not the only potential ally out there.

1) I've already said i don't think we should give such a high gift to the mermaid.
2) umm... we can... see that play out as is

1) Those skills can just as easily be turned to help us get other mates, and would not improve through turning.
2) Her family has disowned her, and i think that if we make the gesture of allowing her to maintain her humanity, we will have earned her undying loyalty, and perhaps the loyalty of the tigerwoman. On the other hand, if we turn her, the tigerwoman may come to hate us.
3) she can do this as a human
4) We do not know that. Also, *she's* a lesbian, not our other night trolls, and her lesbianism does not predispose her to liking or being liked by females more.
5) We've gone through the game well enough without this, and even before we had our consort Weirdsound assured us he had a method of continuing the game.

[Grek]

Re: Hunting:

We should look into that dwarf village nearby, see if that would be a viable hunting location. But, yeah, elves are good prey for now.

[Mlamlah]

I have a strong feeling that I will be the only one who thinks that we should convert Alice
Any attempt to spend a gift meets huge resistance.

As for hunting, I'd prefer to continue milking the forest retreat by patrolling around the fence and snatching the guards..., but I am afraid that we'll lose opportunity to raid the necromancer or get the noble elven... Still son is more important

I'm not opposed to spending gifts, you simply keep insisting we spend it on Alice, which many of us are opposed to. Lets find others.

I agree with you on raiding the elven retreat, if possible using dark manipulation to aid our stealth. I also think that we should use plantlife to help us navigate.