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[King Zultan]

Someone decided that you shouldn't be able to wash clothing in the dark, I don't see whats so hard about using a washboard or a washing machine in the dark.

[Erk]

It's pretty hard to tell if something is still dirty or not in pitch darkness.

[Flying Dice]

It's pretty hard to tell if something is still dirty or not in pitch darkness.

Uh, no? Maybe to distinguish stains, but certainly not to see if it's rank. Remember as well that the only reason you need to wash clothes is that stupid "now with extra tedium" mechanic where clothes on zombies are classed as filthy. You damn well ought to be able to tell that a crusty/damp shirt that reeks of death and bodily fluids is dirty from smell and touch.

[Paul]

Washing machines somehow manage to clean clothes without cameras or visual sensors. Kind of like a guy with a basin of water working in the dark. Ah, the marvels of science - accomplishing that which is otherwise impossible.

[forsaken1111]

I just wish we could actually wash clothes manually the way people did. Make a tub of soapy water and put all the clothes in it, then agitate and scrub. Basically it would be batch washing, and wouldn't take fuckin ages. I can't believe I'm wishing for upgraded clothes washing mechanics this is the most boring action game ever

[Robsoie]

If there's a need for a gamey restriction to washing in the dark for some reason (as it's not realistic to be unable to do so) , why not make the action taking longer instead, maybe as a justification your character may want to make completely sure the item is clean and rub stronger for more time ?

Or introducing a trait like "afraid of the dark" or some kind of fear status etc.. that could lead the character refusing to do any work in the dark.

Fortunately filthy cloth is something you can disable to avoid all of this.

[Broseph Stalin]

It's pretty hard to tell if something is still dirty or not in pitch darkness.

"Pitch Darkness" is the justification for a lot of the fuckery with light issues. No amount of tech and no amount of mutation can ever possibly allow you to do activities in the dark because if there's no light there's no light and no matter how much you amplify it or how sensitive you are you can't see if there's absolutley 0 light.

Despite being used as a realistic broom to sweep away complaints about gameplay this analysis rarely considers actual realism. The darkness will screw you when you still have moonlight or when you're sitting inside at noon with the blinds drawn. It neglects that you can stumble through quite a few things in the dark, even with your eyes closed. Logically if I can't be sure that this batch of clothes is still gore spattered I can give them the old sniff test, feel for bits of yuck, or even say "screw it" and just work them as long as I think is necessary plus a little extra just in case.

With every batch of "realism" changes it looks more and more like realism is less of a goal more like a pretext for fucking the player by making it activities slightly more tedious. Every time you're forced to do something or told you can't do something in the name of realism makes it that much more annoying when you what you would realistically do is impossible.

Angerdone

How are NPC camps working in the newest version? I stopped updating months ago because suddenly a fully upgraded blacksmith and kitchen lost almost every job they had.

[Erk]

Camps are doing well, a whole bunch of new updates coming down the pipe. I've been busy drawing and don't know all the gorey details quite yet, I'll be catching up soon.

Pitch black is quite specific in game, it is meant to be zero light. Any amount of dim light lets you do most things that aren't dark craftable, and as you can see in that pr, so do most darkvision appliances (or they're supposed to). Mostly you see true dark deep inside buildings and underground. It's fair to argue that night shouldn't be so dark, but I don't think many people do their crafting outside at night.

What's with the whining about filth mechanics? It's still trivially easy to turn on and off, and I don't believe there's any plan to make it otherwise at any time, so basically you're just bitching that people are improving a mechanic they enjoy playing.  Personally I never played before filth was added, and turning it off just feels like easy mode, the game is swimming in equipment that normally takes resources to get... But if you like easy mode, turn it off and let us play.

[NullForceOmega]

What's with the whining about filth mechanics? It's still trivially easy to turn on and off, and I don't believe there's any plan to make it otherwise at any time, so basically you're just bitching that people are improving a mechanic they enjoy playing.  Personally I never played before filth was added, and turning it off just feels like easy mode, the game is swimming in equipment that normally takes resources to get... But if you like easy mode, turn it off and let us play.

Then you need to understand that most of the players in this thread have been playing the game for years longer than you have, as the mechanic being discussed is something that was added long, long after they started playing.  For fuck's sake the last time I even downloaded the game was before that addition.

Also, you really should watch the level of passive-aggressive in your tone here, the community has so far been very welcoming and positive, but using words like 'whining', 'bitching' and 'easy mode' is likely to piss some people off pretty badly.

[Broseph Stalin]

The problem is that it's not difficult to wash clothes. Nothing actually becomes dirty it's just one extra step to make use of the clothes you get from zombies. The reason it gets heaped on is because it's a shallow and rather tedious mechanic that was implemented quite poorly in the beginning and has risen to the lofty heights of shallow and rather tedious but less obtrusive. It gets brought up a lot because there are echoes of that basic pattern in a lot of changes.

It's also cold comfort that it's easily removed since that's something that's expressly not going to happen with other features.

[scourge728]

It's pretty hard to tell if something is still dirty or not in pitch darkness.

"Pitch Darkness" is the justification for a lot of the fuckery with light issues. No amount of tech and no amount of mutation can ever possibly allow you to do activities in the dark because if there's no light there's no light and no matter how much you amplify it or how sensitive you are you can't see if there's absolutley 0 light.

Despite being used as a realistic broom to sweep away complaints about gameplay this analysis rarely considers actual realism. The darkness will screw you when you still have moonlight or when you're sitting inside at noon with the blinds drawn. It neglects that you can stumble through quite a few things in the dark, even with your eyes closed. Logically if I can't be sure that this batch of clothes is still gore spattered I can give them the old sniff test, feel for bits of yuck, or even say "screw it" and just work them as long as I think is necessary plus a little extra just in case.

With every batch of "realism" changes it looks more and more like realism is less of a goal more like a pretext for fucking the player by making it activities slightly more tedious. Every time you're forced to do something or told you can't do something in the name of realism makes it that much more annoying when you what you would realistically do is impossible.

Angerdone

How are NPC camps working in the newest version? I stopped updating months ago because suddenly a fully upgraded blacksmith and kitchen lost almost every job they had.

Also: Flashlight bionics or bioluminescence would be fun

[Broseph Stalin]

Cranial Flashlight CBM is in.

[Erk]

(edit to add: sorry for the bitchiness above. I fell and hurt my ass and took it out on you guys, shouldn't have done that. Literally butthurt.)

I don't really see it heaped on anywhere but here. It is a mechanic that slows down resource acquisition in the early game, and makes some of the easier to acquire gear more of a choice, extending the timeframe of the (to me anyway) fun part of the early game. Generally everyone has gotten used to it; to me, it's how the game has always been, and like I said, it feels shallower without it.

I realize for a lot of the folks in this thread specifically, the game has moved in a different direction than you'd have liked, but it's been moving in that direction for what, five years now? There's now a large (very large, in fact) user base for whom those features are what brought us in. I decided to start contributing because I like playing a post apocalyptic survival simulator with zombies, and I'm by far not the only person. That's why development and forums for the game are significantly more active than they've ever been. If it's not your bag, that's too bad, I guess, but you'd probably be better off accepting at this point that "I did surgery on my own eyeball" is not going to be the direction things are developing, and "I need to build a shelter from windchill, it'll also keep my scent from spreading to that horde west of here" is.

Anyway, my work was unbelievably slow today so I drew a bunch of stuff including but not limited to a zombie brute. It's looking increasingly plausible that this will actually become a tileset, there are several other contributors now.

[Mech#4]

I liked the progress you've made on the tileset so far and thought I'd do some pieces myself.


Left to right, top to bottom: Smoker, Shocker, Fat, Bloated, Boomer, Bat, Decayed, Crawling, Acidic.
I've tried to keep close to how the existing zombies look. Not shown here is the Smoker's smoke is transparent as well as the blue around the Shockers lightning. Any suggestions anyone?

The bats not fully done, would you prefer it to be large for visability or smaller since it is just a bat and not a giant bat?

[Erk]

Nice stuff! You've hit on one of our big sticking points about sprite size, I would say make it as big as you can get away with without it looking enormous, but try to keep it from being as big as a survivor. Err on the side of large and recognizable if in doubt.

Your style is slightly different than mine, would you mind if I edited a few details and bounced it back off you? Or you could join me in the discord at https://discord.gg/kAXNZuy and I'll discuss it with you in realtime. They look great though.