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[Teneb]

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/oct/03/amber-rudd-viewers-of-online-terrorist-material-face-15-years-in-jail
WAKE ME UP
WAKE ME UP INSIDE
CAN'T WAKE UP
WAKE ME UP INSIDE
SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAVE MEEEEEEEEEEEEE

* Loud Whispers has been moved to Channel Fort 5 for seditious shitposting

We have now reached DEFCOM Orwell. Deploy tinfoil hats.

[martinuzz]

Dutch patient organisation Inspire2Live is going to try to duplicate expensive cancer medication, and put it on the market for a fraction of the current price.
With this action, they are hoping to provoke a test case trial, when the patent owning pharmaceutical companies sue them.
"We want to provoke a test case, to make a judge decide what is more important: the right to health and healthcare, or patent right", says Peter Kapitein, driving force behind the initiative.

The plan is to either duplicate Nivolumab (used for treating lung cancer), or Olaparib (ovary cancer). Both medicine cost many tens of thousands of euros per patient per year. When first introduced, Nivolumab even cost 134 thousand euros per patient per year. Because of it's high price, it wasn't included in health insurance initially. "This has cost the lives of people", says Kapitein.

The counterfeit medication will cost about 1/10th of the patented drugs, according to Kapitein.
Inspire2Live emphasizes that it's action is not intended to annoy the pharmaceutical industry.
"It is the government we are aiming for. They give the patent holder a 15 year monopoly when they create a new drug. Those laws - that allow producers to ask any price they want for 15 years - has to change".

Inspire2Live has formed an alliance with Cinderella Therapeutics, a foundation that develops medication that is not commercially interesting.
"We have already forged Olaparib for an individual patient", says hemato-oncologist Haagenbeek, chairman of Cinderella Therapeutics. "Nivolumab is a bit harder, because it's a protein, but we will succeed in producing that too.

The ingredients will be obtained from India and China, according to the Inspire2Live website.

According to the official producer of Nivolumab, Bristol Myers Squibb, it won't be very easy to reproduce that drug. "We shall patiently await the developments", says the company's spokesman.

Arnold Versteeg, a lawyer from Amsterdam, specialized in healthcare says that "patent right is very strong. However, a test case trial shouldn't be dismissed as hopeless. The owner of a patent does have a legal obligation to take the consumer's rights into account. Especially with medication that can mean the difference between life and death".

https://www.volkskrant.nl/wetenschap/patientenorganisatie-hoopt-kankermedicatie-goedkoper-te-maken-door-te-kopieren~a4520113/

interesting, let's see how that plays out

[martinuzz]

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/oct/03/amber-rudd-viewers-of-online-terrorist-material-face-15-years-in-jail
WAKE ME UP
WAKE ME UP INSIDE
CAN'T WAKE UP
WAKE ME UP INSIDE
SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAVE MEEEEEEEEEEEEE

* Loud Whispers has been moved to Channel Fort 5 for seditious shitposting

But then, what exactly is terrorist content? Does Boatmurdered classify too?

[Teneb]

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/oct/03/amber-rudd-viewers-of-online-terrorist-material-face-15-years-in-jail
WAKE ME UP
WAKE ME UP INSIDE
CAN'T WAKE UP
WAKE ME UP INSIDE
SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAVE MEEEEEEEEEEEEE

* Loud Whispers has been moved to Channel Fort 5 for seditious shitposting

But then, what exactly is terrorist content? Does Boatmurdered classify too?

Bay12 is a terrorist training website. Here we practice in the dankest memetic warfare techniques for when we must clash against the foes of the One Toad.

How will they even enforce this shit?

[ChairmanPoo]

Dutch patient organisation Inspire2Live is going to try to duplicate expensive cancer medication, and put it on the market for a fraction of the current price.
With this action, they are hoping to provoke a test case trial, when the patent owning pharmaceutical companies sue them.
"We want to provoke a test case, to make a judge decide what is more important: the right to health and healthcare, or patent right", says Peter Kapitein, driving force behind the initiative.

The plan is to either duplicate Nivolumab (used for treating lung cancer), or Olaparib (ovary cancer). Both medicine cost many tens of thousands of euros per patient per year. When first introduced, Nivolumab even cost 134 thousand euros per patient per year. Because of it's high price, it wasn't included in health insurance initially. "This has cost the lives of people", says Kapitein.

The counterfeit medication will cost about 1/10th of the patented drugs, according to Kapitein.
Inspire2Live emphasizes that it's action is not intended to annoy the pharmaceutical industry.
"It is the government we are aiming for. They give the patent holder a 15 year monopoly when they create a new drug. Those laws - that allow producers to ask any price they want for 15 years - has to change".

Inspire2Live has formed an alliance with Cinderella Therapeutics, a foundation that develops medication that is not commercially interesting.
"We have already forged Olaparib for an individual patient", says hemato-oncologist Haagenbeek, chairman of Cinderella Therapeutics. "Nivolumab is a bit harder, because it's a protein, but we will succeed in producing that too.

The ingredients will be obtained from India and China, according to the Inspire2Live website.

According to the official producer of Nivolumab, Bristol Myers Squibb, it won't be very easy to reproduce that drug. "We shall patiently await the developments", says the company's spokesman.

Arnold Versteeg, a lawyer from Amsterdam, specialized in healthcare says that "patent right is very strong. However, a test case trial shouldn't be dismissed as hopeless. The owner of a patent does have a legal obligation to take the consumer's rights into account. Especially with medication that can mean the difference between life and death".

https://www.volkskrant.nl/wetenschap/patientenorganisatie-hoopt-kankermedicatie-goedkoper-te-maken-door-te-kopieren~a4520113/

interesting, let's see how that plays out

Its a  bad idea.
First: India tried this already.  They're flooded with useless counterfeits. The fact that they are intending to emulate the indian system and actually  buy stuff from them is disencouraging.

Second: drugs do, in fact have expensive development costs. Maybe the pharma companies exaggerate those costs, and maybe the system requires a review. But simply doing away with patents is no solution

[Grim Portent]

How will they even enforce this shit?

Obviously by selling off the NHS to pay for an anti-cyber-communist-terror-brigade completely composed of cyborgs whose blood has been replaced by breakfast tea, their skin by Union Jacks and who can only communicate by singing coded renditions of God Save the Queen in the voice of robocop.

[hector13]

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/oct/03/amber-rudd-viewers-of-online-terrorist-material-face-15-years-in-jail
WAKE ME UP
WAKE ME UP INSIDE
CAN'T WAKE UP
WAKE ME UP INSIDE
SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAVE MEEEEEEEEEEEEE

* Loud Whispers has been moved to Channel Fort 5 for seditious shitposting

But then, what exactly is terrorist content? Does Boatmurdered classify too?

Bay12 is a terrorist training website. Here we practice in the dankest memetic warfare techniques for when we must clash against the foes of the One Toad.

How will they even enforce this shit?

Hey man, we have a child raising tutorial somewhere around here involving essentially locking them in a room with dogs 'til they come of age.

I guess I have to be worried about the police meeting me off the plane when I go back to visit my family, huh?

[Strife26]

Simple. It'll be another thing in the future government's back pocket to smash people they don't like into the ground. Arbitrary enforcement does as much towards the government goals as anything else.

[RedKing]

On the other hand, if it means British members of /pol/ wind up getting a short, nasty visit from the SAS....well, there's always a silver lining.

[Reelya]

Sweet jesus it very much wont come to that. Once again, where are you getting your news?

This is not Civil War Mk II no matter how much some people here seem to be having wet dreams about that. This is a softer rehasal of what went on in the Basque Country in the 80s and 90s (in fact a Basque journalist quipped that this whole ordeal was like Stranger Things for Basque millennials: it kind of reminds us of our childhood).   I think at worst we're talking about the same kind of issues (eg: radicals relaunching Terra Lliure or something like that), smoldering violence for a few years, and then a settlement.  Hopefully it wont even come to that, and after a show of holding a kangaroo trial for the more visible heads of the referendum, both parties will skip the insanity of political violence and come to a settlement directly after a few months. The finance minister hinted as much, Europe is pressing in that direction, and it's what  JxSi really wants anyway (regardless of the rhetoric), so its the most likely outcome.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ETA_attacks

ETA attacks: 1969-2011.

2010

    February 17: A small bomb goes off in front of an employment institute office in Vitoria.[235]
    March 16: An officer of the French Police Nationale is killed in a shootout with ETA members in Dammarie-lès-Lys, near Paris.[236]
    April 12: 14 train stations around Guipuzcoa and Vizacya are attacked by groups of young independentists.[237]
    April 16: A small bomb exploded at an agency of Telefonica in Llodio. Groups linked to ETA were blamed.[238]
    May 9: Two small explosive devices explode in the home of a judge and a security guard in San Sebastián.
    June 23: ETA said it had planted four bombs to roads and railways in the city of Valencia. No bombs were found.[239]
    August: Violence spreads along the Basque Country after a series of coordinated kale borroka attacks. Several trash containers and a building are burnt in Ondarroa on August 7,[240] dozens of trash containers are burnt in the town of Zarautz on August 11 leaving two police officers injured,[240] a petrol bomb is thrown at a post office in Zalla on August 13,[241] two trucks working on a TAV-related project are burnt and destroyed in Andoain on August 16,[240] several trash containers are burnt in the cities of Azkoitia and Vitoria on August 17,[240] more trash containers are burnt in Vitoria on August 18,[242] eight trash containers and several cars are burnt in the city of Bilbao and petrol bombs are thrown in Amorebieta on August 20.[243] An explosive device went off in Bilbao on August 21.[244]
    September 16: A small bomb goes off in an industrial zone of Vitoria, causing damage but no injuries. It is believed to be a kale borroka attack, youth groups linked to ETA.[245]
    December 20: A commando of ETA hides about 7,000 smart cards and plastic supports format card, and seven specialized printers and several printing software in a business located in Bourg-de-Péage in France.[246]

Sorry but the ETA thing went on for many years with steady terrorist attacks. The thing is, it depends on Spain. If they send the army in and unilaterally crush the local government then you could well see an ETA like scenario taking place. If you take the head off a movement then you have nobody to stop the radicals doing what radicals do. Remember, Catalonia is much larger than the Basque country. That's 7 million people who could take it upon themselves to cause violence and push the Spanish out, which about triple the total size of the Basque community. But ETA only enjoyed popular support of 12% in ~1981 at the peak of their rebellion, while the independence referendum in Catalonia had 90% yes votes. Even if you assume that all the "no" people just stayed home that day, then there are over 2 million people who risked Spanish police to cast that vote. And you can't see that any of them would be willing to fight for this?

So you're right. This isn't like Basque separatism: it's much bigger and more generally popular than that.

Spain just sent in the army to secure Catalonia btw.

i'm not sure, but your assertion that a large chunk of your country threatening to split off, the government sending in police with truncheons injuring almost 1000 citizens, then deploying the army right before that region is due to declare secession. To be honest, the "all over in a couple of months" sounds like extreme wishful thinking. "All home by Christmas". We've heard that before.

[da_nang]

Spain just sent in the army to secure Catalonia btw.

i'm not sure, but your assertion that a large chunk of your country threatening to split off, the government sending in police with truncheons injuring almost 1000 citizens, then deploying the army right before that region is due to declare secession. To be honest, the "all over in a couple of months" sounds like extreme wishful thinking. "All home by Christmas". We've heard that before.

From what I've read and heard, the army units being sent were supply and logistics units meant to support the police stationed there.

[scriver]

Yes, if you are able to it is proper strategy to establish supply and logistics before any combat breaks out.

[ChairmanPoo]

Reelya...I'm going to try to stay polite because your misrepresentation of thr situation and of where I stand is irking me

 I'm very aware of ETA. I'm Basque. That blurb you copypasted? That very much was my childhood. That is exactly what I meant with "smoldering violence for a few years and a negotiation later". That is why I am hoping against hope that cooler heads and international pressure prevail and both sides sit down to negotiate. I wouldn't wish the same on anyone.  Even so, that is not a civil war scenario.  This is something different altogether.  And I mentioned "Terra Lliure" specifically because Catalonia did have a separatist terrorism problem in the past already. Which you would know if you had kept reading instead of pasting at me a blurb about Basque terroris.

And btw not like it matters, but Catalonia is not "much larger" than Euskadi. Population wise its about twice as large.

BTW: one of the things that made me more nationalistic was how people in Castile (even nominally left wing) did not want a negotiated peace in the Basque country, they preferred to "keep going", even if it took decades of violence (violence that mostly affected the Basque Country), whereas even Basque nonnationalistic conservatives wanted for it to stop, the sooner the better. It made me feel that the goverment in Madrid didn't give  two flying fucks about what happened in the Basque Country... just as you apparently care more about some abstract guerrilla to politifap to, than the actual consequences of this. 
I don't want what happened to us to happen to Catalonia. I don't want Catalonian radicals getting exalted. I don't want OUR radicals getting exalted after the events in Catalonia either. Thst's why I very much want the EU, or the Vatican, or WHOEVER to sit down both parties and force a talk

[scriver]

Basque in it

[Reelya]

BTW: one of the things that made me more nationalistic was how people in Castile (even nominally left wing) did not want a negotiated peace in the Basque country, they preferred to "keep going", even if it took decades of violence (violence that mostly affected the Basque Country), whereas even Basque nonnationalistic conservatives wanted for it to stop, the sooner the better. It made me feel that the goverment in Madrid didn't give  two flying fucks about what happened in the Basque Country... just as you apparently care more about some abstract guerrilla to politifap to, than the actual consequences of this. 
I don't want what happened to us to happen to Catalonia. I don't want Catalonian radicals getting exalted. I don't want OUR radicals getting exalted after the events in Catalonia either. Thst's why I very much want the EU, or the Vatican, or WHOEVER to sit down both parties and force a talk

You seem to be mistaken about one thing. What I've said is what I see as likely to happen based on the information that's been presented. Has nothing to do with what I "want" to happen. The locals have said they're going to declare independence with the next couple of days, the government started moving support troops into the area. It's not hard to see there's a clash coming. two sides, neither backing down and both with increasing rhetoric.

Is it a "wank" to assume the worst might happen and talk about that? Or is it just being pragmatic?

I don't want what happened to us to happen to Catalonia. I don't want Catalonian radicals getting exalted. I don't want OUR radicals getting exalted after the events in Catalonia either. Thst's why I very much want the EU, or the Vatican, or WHOEVER to sit down both parties and force a talk

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_consequences

Appeal to consequences, also known as argumentum ad consequentiam (Latin for "argument to the consequences"), is an argument that concludes a hypothesis (typically a belief) to be either true or false based on whether the premise leads to desirable or undesirable consequences. This is based on an appeal to emotion and is a type of informal fallacy, since the desirability of a premise's consequence does not make the premise true.

^ This only weakens a logical argument to determine whether something is true or not.