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Author Topic: Brexit! Conversation Continued  (Read 182411 times)

Neonivek

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1575 on: May 03, 2017, 12:30:28 pm »

ftfy

Ohh no, you don't know what you done! Winter is coming.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2017, 12:32:31 pm by Neonivek »
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1576 on: May 03, 2017, 07:32:46 pm »

dohoho

Loud Whispers

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1577 on: May 04, 2017, 07:03:01 am »

'Many votes were challenged for failure to pay taxes, and on both sides charges were made that "names had been used of Persons who are dead, who were absent, or who never lived." "All ye Discourse of ye City is upon ye affair of ye Elections of a Sheriff," said a newsletter report sent to Viscout Perceval on March 24. "They talk of great Frauds and Abuses in ye Poll, but it can't be supposed they are all on one Side.'
-London and the National Government, Alfred James Henderson

Rather amused researching into the origins of modern day corruption, this is pretty much obligatory

smjjames

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1578 on: May 05, 2017, 09:51:32 am »

Juncker uses French, BBC comments lose their mind while pretending to not care.

Don't the French also complain about French language losing importance or otherwise taken over by English? They're pretty defensive about it apparently.

It looks more like the usual rivalry between France and England and the typical sillyness that goes on between the two. At least both countries are good natured about the rivalry these days and the rowdiest it gets is over a soccer match.
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martinuzz

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1579 on: May 05, 2017, 10:27:05 am »

Juncker uses French, BBC comments lose their mind while pretending to not care.

Don't the French also complain about French language losing importance or otherwise taken over by English? They're pretty defensive about it apparently.

It looks more like the usual rivalry between France and England and the typical sillyness that goes on between the two. At least both countries are good natured about the rivalry these days and the rowdiest it gets is over a soccer match.
Do keep in mind that French used to be the international lingua franca amongst diplomats in Europe up until not too long ago (up to the mid-20th century). It still persists in the IOC and the FIFA to today.
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http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=73719.msg1830479#msg1830479

ChairmanPoo

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1580 on: May 05, 2017, 10:38:39 am »

I think that at this point all major Europeam languages have been lingua franca at one point or another
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smjjames

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1581 on: May 05, 2017, 10:54:37 am »

Juncker uses French, BBC comments lose their mind while pretending to not care.

Don't the French also complain about French language losing importance or otherwise taken over by English? They're pretty defensive about it apparently.

It looks more like the usual rivalry between France and England and the typical sillyness that goes on between the two. At least both countries are good natured about the rivalry these days and the rowdiest it gets is over a soccer match.
No, these are the BBC comments. The guys that comment seem to be a bit... strange. And slightly toxic.

One thing I've noticed about them is they seem to almost completely disagree with the Tories policies. Mass surveillance, defunding the NHS etc., yet the mere suggestion they vote for someone else makes them lose their shit.

Commentators on news articles are always dumb.

I think that at this point all major Europeam languages have been lingua franca at one point or another

I don't think Spanish has been. Italian (or a deriviative of it) certainly was at one point because Italian traders. German and French have definetly had their time as Lingua Francas.
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ChairmanPoo

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1582 on: May 05, 2017, 11:24:12 am »

Quote
I don't think Spanish has been

Spanish was very much a lingua franca back in the day.  Srsly, this is like, basic European history.
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There's two kinds of performance reviews: the one you make they don't read, the one they make whilst they sharpen their daggers
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smjjames

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1583 on: May 05, 2017, 11:27:39 am »

Quote
I don't think Spanish has been

Spanish was very much a lingua franca back in the day.  Srsly, this is like, basic European history.

Sorry.
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scriver

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1584 on: May 05, 2017, 12:23:10 pm »

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Spanish was used as a lingua franca throughout the former Spanish Colonial Empire

Yeah, an Swedish is used all throughout Sweden too.
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Love, scriver~

inteuniso

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1585 on: May 05, 2017, 12:35:51 pm »

Yeah other germanic languages never achieved the proliferation of English. Maybe in the future?
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smjjames

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1586 on: May 05, 2017, 12:40:32 pm »

Yeah other germanic languages never achieved the proliferation of English. Maybe in the future?

Or Spanish could have it's heyday again? Not really something that can be predicted.
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ChairmanPoo

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1587 on: May 05, 2017, 02:53:50 pm »

If I had to bet I'd lean on Chinese gaining importance in the XXI century.  I mean, widely spoken languages will stay relevant, just as Spanish and French stayed relevant after the collapse of their respective colonial empires. But I think 'lingua franca' status tends to gravitate to geopolitical dominance, and at this point its pretty clear that China will grow larger.
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There's two kinds of performance reviews: the one you make they don't read, the one they make whilst they sharpen their daggers
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1588 on: May 05, 2017, 03:07:59 pm »

China hasn't sealed the deal yet. They've become vastly closer to matching the West, but there's still both a lot of poverty and economic uncertainty left to deal with which could knock them off track. It wasn't that long ago that Japan was seen in a similar light as China, but ultimately settled.

I think China also has another problem. They're not that great at exporting soft power. Sure, their skill at leveraging economic dominance is pretty good, but they're an incredibly insular culture compared to Spain, France, Britain, or America. China's external culture power is honestly pretty low, and I'm not sure they have the societal values to grow it unless there are major changes. Without that, could it truly claim geopolitical dominance? And if Chinese economic growth does stagnate, what do they have left if there's not high culture power?

There's also another issue. The age of colonialism permitted the forceful spread of Spanish, French, and English all over the world. And the three traded places as the lingua franca as time went on. But those three are also all related languages. Mandarin both is of an entirely different language family and uses a different written form, not even just a different alphabet. It was way easier for Spanish, French, and English dominance to pass between one another than it would be for it to pass from English to Mandarin.

I'm not saying it's impossible, but I'm still skeptical of these things. Our ability to project geopolitical futures has often been kind of...off. *glances at hundreds of stories of the Cold War continuing in perpetuity*
« Last Edit: May 05, 2017, 03:09:34 pm by MetalSlimeHunt »
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smjjames

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Re: Brexit! Conversation Continued
« Reply #1589 on: May 05, 2017, 07:36:57 pm »

Yeah, China doesn't seem particularily big on exporting culture. Theres some in the immediate regionally, but that's about it.
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