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Author Topic: Team Fortress 2: World's #1 War-Based Hat Simulator  (Read 781759 times)

USEC_OFFICER

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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7170 on: October 02, 2011, 09:49:26 pm »

Reserve Shooter for Pyro plus Degreaser? As if you really needed FASTER weapon switch.

I'm assuming no faster weapon switch on the reserve shooter, just the mini-crits. Valve can't be that stupid, can they?
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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7171 on: October 02, 2011, 10:01:22 pm »

 You know how you can't really notice the faster weapon switch on the RS on the soldier, the only effects taking effect during weapon switch-heavy play? And how pyros don't really utilize their faster weapon switch all the time, instead keeping one weapon for a few seconds until another is needed? The extra 15% is not a problem at all. Such small switch increases only work with weapons that have long fire times and long switch times. A Degreaser pyro has neither.

 I dunno if I gave my analysis on this change yet, but here it is again if that's the case. The pyro already has two weapons that provide increased damage in specific situations, the Axetinguisher and the Flaregun. One has more raw power while the other one has more range, but both lack flexibility and versatility. The flaregun has great ranged capabilities and can deal a good bit of damage, but is very slow to use and can't deal with more than one threat at a time. The Axetinguisher is pretty much the same, exchanging range for killing your enemy before they realize you are there. Even less capable of dealing with multiple threats because you die so fast at that range.

 The Reserve Shooter exchanges both extreme range and raw power for increased versatility. It is much more capable of dealing with a multitude of situations and threats a Pyro has, like scouts kiting like the little bastards they are, or rocket jumping soldiers, or anything they just airblasted. It won't do as much damage as either weapon in their optimal range but deals a decent amount in most ranges, no real weak spots.

 The Pyro still has a major weakness to multiple targets with the smaller clip. Airblast can control crowds and help you escape unfortunate situations like that, but you won't have any firepower to deal with any followers.(Do note the irony of the word fire in that sentence)
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PsyberianHusky

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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7172 on: October 02, 2011, 11:48:20 pm »

Well what about airblasting and Reserve shooting?
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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7173 on: October 03, 2011, 12:18:26 am »

The degreaser is quite useful with the axtinguisher, though.
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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7174 on: October 03, 2011, 12:25:26 am »

Well what about airblasting and Reserve shooting?
My analysis is based around the idea that utilizing the RS is about as easy as utilizing all the other pyro weapons that receive a situational damage buff. It may be a bit trickier, you can only damage them in the second and a half they are in the air from a single airblast as opposed to afterburn duration. Multiple airblasts can make a single opponent stay in the air for like three seconds, but this also makes the pyro very easy to kill.

 The faster fire rate when compared to the flaregun does not apply due to the smaller window where the damage bonus applies. You might get an extra shot or two off if you are quick, but at the range you airblast people at the falloff and pellet spread equalizes the damage. Getting in close while your opponent is in the air somehow will deal a good deal more damage than the flaregun crits, but not as much as the axetinguisher.

 I really should get the specific numbers, I only remember the general range they follow in comparison to eachother.
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Werdna

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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7175 on: October 04, 2011, 04:43:02 pm »

If they are buffing the flamethrower (I assume damage), then I'm not quite sure that Degreaser+Axetinguisher is going to outshine Backburner and the option to do something else in the melee slot?  I can't see myself ditching the Flaregun for Reserve Shooter either, the value of having something that can deal damage at both medium and long range is too great.  Shotgun damage just tails off too quick at range even with crits.
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Enzo

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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7176 on: October 04, 2011, 05:20:52 pm »

If they are buffing the flamethrower (I assume damage), then I'm not quite sure that Degreaser+Axetinguisher is going to outshine Backburner and the option to do something else in the melee slot?

The Flamethrower is (maybe) getting a buff, not the Backburner. The beta is giving the flamethrower the +10% damage bonus that the Backburner already has, rendering their base damages the same and the Backburner unchanged.

It also has the Degreaser with no afterburn penalty and -10% damage. If they do that Degreaser+Axetinguisher is only going to be better, because you'll have full afterburn to take out anyone who escapes your axe blows.
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PsyberianHusky

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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7177 on: October 04, 2011, 05:55:21 pm »

If they are buffing the flamethrower (I assume damage), then I'm not quite sure that Degreaser+Axetinguisher is going to outshine Backburner and the option to do something else in the melee slot?

The Flamethrower is (maybe) getting a buff, not the Backburner. The beta is giving the flamethrower the +10% damage bonus that the Backburner already has, rendering their base damages the same and the Backburner unchanged.

It also has the Degreaser with no afterburn penalty and -10% damage. If they do that Degreaser+Axetinguisher is only going to be better, because you'll have full afterburn to take out anyone who escapes your axe blows.
I am glad pyros are getting looked at.
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Bdthemag

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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7178 on: October 04, 2011, 10:12:02 pm »

If they are buffing the flamethrower (I assume damage), then I'm not quite sure that Degreaser+Axetinguisher is going to outshine Backburner and the option to do something else in the melee slot?

The Flamethrower is (maybe) getting a buff, not the Backburner. The beta is giving the flamethrower the +10% damage bonus that the Backburner already has, rendering their base damages the same and the Backburner unchanged.

It also has the Degreaser with no afterburn penalty and -10% damage. If they do that Degreaser+Axetinguisher is only going to be better, because you'll have full afterburn to take out anyone who escapes your axe blows.
I am glad pyros are getting looked at.
And this is the part where the people who think the Pyro isn't underpowered come in...
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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7179 on: October 05, 2011, 03:57:46 am »

My only issue with the Pyro is I swear to fucking God the flames hit you they hit you this is bullshit.

Other than that, I'm a very casual player so I never notice it if the Pyro isn't.
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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7180 on: October 05, 2011, 04:35:51 am »

And this is the part where the people who think the Pyro isn't underpowered come in...

Since the backburner keeps the same stats, and the degreaser loses 1% flame damage for a third more afterburn damage you'd have to think the flamethrower isn't underpowered, not just the pyro, to disagree with this.

It's weird how on the SPUF many people talked about how happy they were when the backburner lost it's 10% more damage then the flamethrower, but didn't complain when it was later revealed to be staying the same in terms of damage.
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PTTG??

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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7181 on: October 05, 2011, 09:39:45 am »

Why is the demo such a melee-favored class by the devs? The pyro is the real close-in fighter. Outside of medieval mode, he's the one most likely to get melee kills.

I don't know about you, but with a shield charge or some other special ability, the Pyro would be scary.

EDIT: I take that back, if you had a shield charge, you'd be scary too.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2011, 12:38:36 pm by PTTG?? »
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Cecilff2

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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7182 on: October 05, 2011, 09:46:54 am »

Why is the demo such a melee-favored class by the devs? The pyro is the real close-in fighter. Outside of medieval mode, he's the one most likely to get melee kills.

I don't know about you, but with a shield charge or some other special ability, the Pyro would be scary.

Or if the airblast could be used as a rocket jump technique.(That isn't dependant on actual rockets)
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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7183 on: October 05, 2011, 10:13:15 am »

Or if they actually kept the flare jump on the detonator.

I absolutely refuse to call that two-inch nudge a flare jump.
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Re: Team Fortress 2: Free To Play! Deus Ex promos! Heavy with a bionic arm!
« Reply #7184 on: October 05, 2011, 05:11:05 pm »

 Unlocks were made apparently to create less versatile weapons that change up how the class is played. Many unlocks also fill in a weakness in the class at the cost of another different weakness. That would explain all the bullshit with the Demo.

 The detonator was apparently never made to grant a junp, so they nerfed it outside of beta. Really, Pyro just need a class-based movement buff and not anything from an unlock. At this point I would be okay with all the flamethrowers losing 10-15% damage so long as the Pyro got a small airblast jump at the cost of extra ammo.
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