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[GiglameshDespair]

TIL that whenever someone tries to troll me online, I'm getting assaulted. At least, according to the U.N.

Well, after reading the article, that's a serious misstatement of what they were talking about.

They're talking about orchestrated abusive speech online, which is a fair bit different than someone typing "GO DIE BITCH" in the heat of the moment in a game or on a message board. This is more of the "4chan/Redditors decide to ruin someone's life for the lulz" kind of shit. Which I'm a lot less sanguine about defending.

It refers to 73% of women having encountered "Cyberviolence" online. So unless 73% of women have been subjected to a orchestrated campaign, they're talking about

The U.N. defines violence against women as “any act of gender-based violence that results in, or is likely to result in, physical, sexual or psychological harm or suffering to women, including threats of such acts.” The report notes that cyber violence is an extension of that definition, that includes acts like trolling, hacking, spamming, and harassment.

That's anything, not just a campaign.

[IcyTea31]

I decided to actually read the report and not just the news item before posting. It's almost a caricature of confirmation bias and unsourced, contradictory statistics. Another statistic (still unsourced) in the paper gave Denmark the highest percentage of all violence against women, not just online, allegedly 52%. Yet another statistic makes it 18% in the EU, "which corresponds to about 9 million women". 9 million out of the female half of 500 million is 3,6%; how does math work?

While I agree cyberbullying (targeted at women or otherwise) is terrible, contradictory statistics and alarmism aren't going to help.

[Neonivek]

While I agree cyberbullying (targeted at women or otherwise) is terrible, contradictory statistics and alarmism aren't going to help.

Uhh haven't we learned anything over these years? Completely inaccurate statistics that make the problem seem 10 times larger then it actually is along with completely fabricated facts is the ONLY way to bring about social change.

That is why if you buy a gun you are 50% likely to shoot your kids. And why 50% of the world's population is gay. And why everyone in New York gets mugged at least once every twenty years.

[NJW2000]

Lack of understanding of subject here, really.

Suicide cults are infrequent but serious. UN person should realise this.

"I'd love to see your lady-boner right now": very frequent, can be brushed off reasonably easily by most women if it only happens once, though annoying.

UN person decides to attack both at once as both live in the computties

Cue ridicule. Cue normalising/reducing in importance of both.

[GiglameshDespair]

While I agree cyberbullying (targeted at women or otherwise) is terrible, contradictory statistics and alarmism aren't going to help.

Uhh haven't we learned anything over these years? Completely inaccurate statistics that make the problem seem 10 times larger then it actually is along with completely fabricated facts is the ONLY way to bring about social change.

That is why if you buy a gun you are 50% likely to shoot your kids. And why 50% of the world's population is gay. And why everyone in New York gets mugged at least once.

Admittedly the chance of shooting your kids without using a gun is pretty low.

[SealyStar]

"Cyberviolence" is a term that should not exist. Seriously, fuck whoever thinks "Someone was mean on the internet" is violence. I don't give a fuck who it's directed at - anything that does not involve direct physical harm cannot be considered violence by any reasonable person under any circumstances. Swindling the goddamn UN into saying this shit is a slap in the face (no pun intended) to actual victims of violence.

Also, fuck whoever thinks "women and girls" (another "I'll save you, m'lady"ism that should be metaphorically euthanized) need special protection. Fuck whoever thinks men don't suffer from violence. Fuck whoever thinks men don't suffer the majority of real and "cyber" violence in this world. Fuck this code of chivalry bullshit that drives people to think "What about m'lady" 99% of the fuckshitchrist time.

The fact that this wound up before the UN, in my conspiratorial mind, is part of the usual thing where third-world countries with shitty human rights records take advantage of minor problems in Western countries to go after them for "human rights violations".

[Neonivek]

Fuck whoever thinks men don't suffer the majority of real and "cyber" violence in this world.

Ohh that is part of the double standard. Women suffer, men take it.

Because you see if someone insults a man right to his face or punches him... a man always has the option to hit them back. Thus a man cannot be a victim. If a man ever complains or is hurt BECAUSE of the abuse then they are pathetic.

Unless of course it is a young male child.

While women is insulted they are completely and utterly defenseless and incapable of any action and need to be saved. Thus they are always a victim. Assuming they aren't considered to have invited it, in which case they were intentionally trying to be a victim.

It sucks all over.

[Flying Dice]

Wow, the UN really is a joke these days, isn't it? Makes all the older stories where it turned into a meaningful political entity sort of laughable.

Alternatively: Gee, LoN 2.0 sure did manage to stagger a long way before tumbling over.


I mean, fuck, this reads like an Onion article about SJWs.

[Neonivek]

Wow, the UN really is a joke these days, isn't it? Makes all the older stories where it turned into a meaningful political entity sort of laughable.

Alternatively: Gee, LoN 2.0 sure did manage to stagger a long way before tumbling over.


I mean, fuck, this reads like an Onion article about SJWs.

Look a LOT of things end up being put infront of the UN. Some dumb, some smart. Remember that the UN also was presented with a "Alternate human rights that only applied to the Middle Eastern nations" that basically was "women got little rights", it was shot down.

A lot of diplomacy is listening to everyone... even the crazy and dumb people.

[IcyTea31]

Uhh haven't we learned anything over these years? Completely inaccurate statistics that make the problem seem 10 times larger then it actually is along with completely fabricated facts is the ONLY way to bring about social change.

Can you give an example of a social change where it could be credited to alarmism?

[Neonivek]

Uhh haven't we learned anything over these years? Completely inaccurate statistics that make the problem seem 10 times larger then it actually is along with completely fabricated facts is the ONLY way to bring about social change.

Can you give an example of a social change where it could be credited to alarmism?

I was being sarcastic

But sure how about Gay rights. At least I cannot seem to see any detriment to all the false statistics, political backstabbing, and all that. Though personally I don't think alarmism helped at all, but I don't have any statistics or info to back it up.

[SealyStar]

Uhh haven't we learned anything over these years? Completely inaccurate statistics that make the problem seem 10 times larger then it actually is along with completely fabricated facts is the ONLY way to bring about social change.

Can you give an example of a social change where it could be credited to alarmism?

I was being sarcastic

But sure how about Gay rights.

How exactly is gay rights attributable to made-up statistics? I don't think anyone ever actually thought gay people were particular large minority.

[Reelya]

We should always look at core research that gives the figures for both genders. If the case is being made that one gender has it worse for any specific thing, then that's a specific claim that needs to be backed up by doing the same research for both genders, and showing a clear difference. Also, what is not told to you is as telling as what is told to you:

http://eric.ed.gov/?id=EJ735111

When gender was considered, significant differences were identified in terms of bullying and cyberbullying. Males were more likely to be bullies and cyberbullies than their female counterparts. In addition, female cyberbully victims were more likely to inform adults than their male counterparts.

Note, that they say more bullies are male, but they do not make any claim whatsoever on the gender of victims. So we can pretty much assume 50% or more of victims are male, or they would have highlighted this in the summary, instead of the next bit where they tell you that females victims are more likely to report being bullied than male victims. Note, this almost sounds like they're trying to imply there are more female victims per se, but they haven't said that at all. It actually says that for people who are already cyberbullying victims, female victims are more likely to tell someone about it, rather than keep it to themselves.

Also, they make no mention of which gender bullied which other gender. If the norm was males bullying females online, well that would definitely have made it into the summary for the report. So was can assume it's mostly people bullying their own gender, and that that majority of male students bullying people was other male students.

So from what we are told, and what they don't tell us, we can assume that in the study under consideration, female victims were not a majority, but they are more likely to report it when it happens to themselves.

[SealyStar]

Anyway, I just remembered the second part of why "cyberviolence" is unadulterated cringe.

[Neonivek]

I will always have an utter sympathy for male victims... Because there is such a learned helplessness with men that is outright taught and enforced by society.

Whenever they speak up it isn't a question as to whether or not they "deserved it" but rather that a man is pathetic for even seeking help.

At least I can state sympathy for them, since frankly no one else does. At least it is changing very slowly.