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[ollobrains]

any alternatives ?

[penguinofhonor]

I'd say that Toribash is an art game about how we take for granted how easily we can control the movements of our own bodies without even considering the huge amount of processes that take place for it to happen.

Oh, so it's like QWOP?

[Fniff]

It's like if the guy from QWOP tried making a martial art.

[Mech#4]

It's not like QWOP in terms of control but I remember a stick figure fighting game where you would grab onto your orange fighters arm/leg/torso/head/whatever and fling them against each other.

[SalmonGod]

It's not like QWOP in terms of control but I remember a stick figure fighting game where you would grab onto your orange fighters arm/leg/torso/head/whatever and fling them against each other.

Rag Doll Kung Fu.  I'm pretty sure it was the first non-Valve game to be released on Steam, back in 2005.  It was pretty fun.  Very different.  Very hard to get used to, and could be very difficult even after you got used to the controls.

[Mech#4]

@SalmonGod: While not the one I was thinking of that seems very similar.

The one I'm thinking of might've been a flash game, you played as simple stick figures on a white background. Ooo... that reminds me of .... *heads to name-of-that-game thread*

[MrWiggles]

How do you make a research tree interesting?

My answer to this is more relating to the space portion, as I'm not so sure on low tech settings, but personally I find it more interesting to be unlocking new weapons, buildings, armour, etc, or modifications to how existing weapons, buildings, armour, etc work.  I find it far less interesting to just be researching +5% attack strength or similar.

So e.g. if I've just researched Laser Cannon technology, I'd much rather future techs in that area be things like adding burst fire, range extension, shield piercing, and so forth, than just researching Laser Cannon II, Laser Cannon III, and maybe +5% to all laser damage.  Ideally there's some kind of tradeoff in using those modifications, whether that be that they're sidegrades with e.g. burst fire having reduced range or accuracy, or just give it an increased cost/weight/whatever, such that you do still have to make a decision about when and where to deploy them (and which ones to deploy).  If you can take a page out of Aurora's book and actually design and research specific weapons based on the tech you've researched that's even better (and expanding on that, e.g. choosing just how much of a burst your burst fire modification is adding - definitely need tradeoffs if you can do that though).

Interesting.  So you want Techs to give you things to do, something active, over something passive.

[Biowraith]

Interesting.  So you want Techs to give you things to do, something active, over something passive.

Pretty much.  I enjoy unlocking new stuff, incorporating them into my designs and tactics, and seeing how well they blow up the AI's stuff (or stop the AI's from blowing up my stuff). 

To be honest, that goes for various genres of games, not just space 4x's.  e.g. I dislike MMORPGs where after a certain point I'm just unlocking Magic Missile III or Shield Bash IV, or spending 5 levels of talent points for +5% fire damage.

[Dutchling]

A game with AI Wars' AI mechanics but with interesting and fun combat / base management.

[Draco18s]

A game with AI Wars' AI mechanics but with interesting and fun combat / base management.

AI War's combat is too...not "fast" but that when a ship counters another ship, it does so so hard that it's not even funny.  Like murders the fuk out of it and only takes 5% of its own health in damage.

[aristabulus]

... So e.g. if I've just researched Laser Cannon technology, I'd much rather future techs in that area be things like adding burst fire, range extension, shield piercing, and so forth, than just researching Laser Cannon II, Laser Cannon III, and maybe +5% to all laser damage.  Ideally there's some kind of tradeoff in using those modifications, whether that be that they're sidegrades with e.g. burst fire having reduced range or accuracy, or just give it an increased cost/weight/whatever, ... 

This is approximately what MOO2 gives with weapons.  At the first tier a weapon becomes available, you've got the basic version with a 90 degree front arc, and maybe a heavy version.  As progress is made the basic version gets smaller, and modifications become available.  Including but not limited to extended firing arc, rapid fire (+shots but -accuracy), ECCM for missile-types.

I would also like to see more nuanced research in 4x games, but the realities of game/software development get in the way.

[Graknorke]

I was under the impression that a lot game upgrades did things like that.
It's hardly a rarity to see a branching upgrade system anyway.

[Biowraith]

This is approximately what MOO2 gives with weapons.

Yeah, which isn't a coincidence - I definitely had MOO2 in mind when I was typing that

[Keita]

A game I want to exist?

A game that has Conker the squirrel in it but not another Bad Fur Day, a completely new game maybe that looks at what happens one day on his throne, drunk, sick and tired of his situation.

Conker the Squirrel: A royal pain in the ass.

[Korbac]

A game I want to exist?

A game that has Conker the squirrel in it but not another Bad Fur Day, a completely new game maybe that looks at what happens one day on his throne, drunk, sick and tired of his situation.

Conker the Squirrel: A royal pain in the ass.

Careful, we may have another Banjo Kazooie : Nuts-o like the original (see what I did there?)