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Author Topic: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies  (Read 130274 times)

Bohandas

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1155 on: November 03, 2015, 07:36:50 pm »

Now I'm trying to remember why no one remembers the Cyberking in Victorian London.  Or the Tyranasaur.  Maybe I'm just not a Time Sensitive.
Whether or not it's the reasoning, shortly after the cyberking (from the series POV) was switch to Doctor 11, and his "cracks in the universe" that led up to the major "universal reboot" of The Big Bang.  All kinds of things can have been 'tidied away' during this process.

Isb't that also the premise of the Discworld novel Thief of Time
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Starver

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1156 on: November 03, 2015, 08:21:13 pm »

Now I'm trying to remember why no one remembers the Cyberking in Victorian London.  Or the Tyranasaur.  Maybe I'm just not a Time Sensitive.
Whether or not it's the reasoning, shortly after the cyberking (from the series POV) was switch to Doctor 11, and his "cracks in the universe" that led up to the major "universal reboot" of The Big Bang.  All kinds of things can have been 'tidied away' during this process.

Isb't that also the premise of the Discworld novel Thief of Time
YesNo.

Canon has it that the events in ToT is the second time such a thing has (almost?) happened.  Canon also usefully suggests that any previous problems with continuity-of-canon is now easily explained because of these 'events'. ;)

(For example, how come the Dysc Theatre is "the first of its kind" in Elizabethan-style 'modern'1 Ankh-Morpork, prior to this companies of actors being of the peripatetic variety without any form of permanent theatre, and yet it sits in the shadow of the Opera House, a centuries-old building an analogue of the French Second Empire architecture.  Simple: It's a result of a hasty repairing of time by the History Monks, after... the incident.  Even though we first saw both before the incident. ;) )

As such, it doesn't so much 'tidy away' anachronisms, as possibly explain them.  The tidying away is done by the human psyche, with the same mechanism that means that living people tend to ignore Death, or reinvent Him as someone that they can better handle during interactions with Him, unless absolutely forced to concentrate on his realer-than-real reality.

OTOH, I still can rationalise the Patrician of TCOM as actually being Vetinari (even though Word Of God has said that it actually wasn't, and may not even have been the same continuity, being written by a less experienced author than the one that wrote the later books), and all without necessitating the involvement of The Men In Saffron.


1 By Disc standards.
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Culise

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1157 on: November 03, 2015, 08:27:37 pm »

OTOH, I still can rationalise the Patrician of TCOM as actually being Vetinari (even though Word Of God has said that it actually wasn't, and may not even have been the same continuity, being written by a less experienced author than the one that wrote the later books), and all without necessitating the involvement of The Men In Saffron.


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I thought WOG was the exact opposite, that the Patrician of the early books was indeed Vetinari as "written by a less experienced author" (to borrow Pratchett's own words).  It's usually the fanbase that tries to identify him with Snapcase or some other Patrician between Snapcase and Vetinari.  That is, you're 100% correct in your rationalization.  Did this end up being reversed at some point? 
« Last Edit: November 03, 2015, 08:43:10 pm by Culise »
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Starver

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1158 on: November 03, 2015, 09:34:10 pm »

I thought WOG was the exact opposite, that the Patrician of the early books was indeed Vetinari as "written by a less experienced author" (to borrow Pratchett's own words).  It's usually the fanbase that tries to identify him with Snapcase or some other Patrician between Snapcase and Vetinari.  That is, you're 100% correct in your rationalization.  Did this end up being reversed at some point?
It might depend on the WOG interview concerned.  I've been a Pratchett fan (...which I am, if you haven't gathered...) for a long time, and there's been a lot of development of opinion along the way... ;)

For the record, my basic theory (not that it's a nitpick that ruins a movie, but... I'm now into this conversation quite deep), in light of all we currently know, is...

Spoiler: long! (click to show/hide)
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LordBaal

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1159 on: November 04, 2015, 10:00:12 am »

I like my time travel histories pretty stern and without sugar. Were the futility of "changing" history via time travel is the rule. If you travel to the past to change the future you won't because the future is how it is thanks in part or completely because you travelled to the past.

It ditch away all those alternate lines and multiverses and you simply end up with a single, unchangeable line.

All You Zombies is, ditching aside the fact that the protagonist works of an agency that prevent changes on time, an excellent work of self-contained consequences of time travel, but perhaps is "too much self-contained"
« Last Edit: November 05, 2015, 10:40:49 am by LordBaal »
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Bohandas

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1160 on: November 05, 2015, 09:51:05 am »

The Da Vinci Code depicts a massive global conspiracy to protect secrets that I can't imagine more than a handful of people in the entire world caring about. I can see in my mind's eye a news report doing a 30 second report on how some higher ups in the catholic heirarchy believe that Jesus had a kid or that such and such person may be his descendant, or that they equate the holy grail with Mary Magdaline, and I can see the person watching this news report flipping to a different channel before it's over.

There's also the issue that the protagonists apparently perceive the Catholic Church as having significant temporal power, despite the action taking place hundreds of years after the end of the middle-ages.
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Bohandas

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1161 on: November 06, 2015, 01:22:54 am »

Can anybody explain to me what is supposed to be frightening about he 1931 version of Frankenstein?

I mean, I suppose the idea of a world where everybody is a stupid panicky reactionary luddite with the except for three people out of the entire population is a frightening idea in theory, but this is clearly not the intended source of the supposed horror and as such is not played to sufficient effect to be truly frightening.

There's the grave robbing aspect, but grave robbing isn't frightening, it's merely disgusting and insulting to the deceased. It's like if somebody took a dump in my mailbox; I'd be offended and disgusted, but it wouldn't frighten me.

The creature does kill a small number of people, but one of them is in self defense, and the others  - in addition to being obvious accidents - are more in the vein of slapstick than horror
« Last Edit: November 06, 2015, 01:31:14 am by Bohandas »
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LordBaal

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1162 on: November 06, 2015, 08:03:24 am »

I guess the mere sight of a monster moving around was enough to be scary back them...
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I'm curious as to how a tank would evolve. Would it climb out of the primordial ooze wiggling it's track-nubs, feeding on smaller jeeps before crawling onto the shore having evolved proper treds?
My ship exploded midflight, but all the shrapnel totally landed on Alpha Centauri before anyone else did.  Bow before me world leaders!

Dirst

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1163 on: November 06, 2015, 09:59:59 am »

I don't recall the 1931 movie in particular, but in the book it was considered self-evident that anything so ugly was evil by nature.  The monster is pretty innocent and naive, though possessed of deus-ex-machina-level cleverness when the story paints itself into a corner (With no memory of any kind, it just instinctively figures out how to tend a campfire?).  There is simply no explanation of why the monster deserves to be pursued and destroyed.

Putting things into modern terms, Frankenstein's monster is horror movie fare because "moving corpse" is right in the middle of the Uncanny Valley.  And this isn't just a moving corpse, it's the sewn-together collage of different corpse pieces.

My nitpick about the book is its pacing.  When Mary Shelley chooses between "showing" and "telling" something, she picks the wrong one pretty much 100% of the time.
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LordBaal

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1164 on: November 06, 2015, 10:09:11 am »

Cue to open a Nitpicks that Ruined Books thread.
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I'm curious as to how a tank would evolve. Would it climb out of the primordial ooze wiggling it's track-nubs, feeding on smaller jeeps before crawling onto the shore having evolved proper treds?
My ship exploded midflight, but all the shrapnel totally landed on Alpha Centauri before anyone else did.  Bow before me world leaders!

Dirst

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1165 on: November 06, 2015, 11:02:47 am »

Cue to open a Nitpicks that Ruined Books thread.
Every movie adaptation goes over the top with special effects as creature is animated, usually with the pull of an oversized Frankenstein Switch™.  But this is what you see in the book:

Quote from: Mary Shelley
It was on a dreary night of November that I beheld the accomplishment of my toils. With an anxiety that almost amounted to agony, I collected the instruments of life around me, that I might infuse a spark of being into the lifeless thing that lay at my feet. It was already one in the morning; the rain pattered dismally against the panes, and my candle was nearly burnt out, when, by the glimmer of the half-extinguished light, I saw the dull yellow eye of the creature open; it breathed hard, and a convulsive motion agitated its limbs.

After two long, whiny paragraphs of how terrible this was we get a brief primer on the Uncanny Valley:

Quote from: Mary Shelley
Oh! no mortal could support the horror of that countenance. A mummy again endued with animation could not be so hideous as that wretch. I had gazed on him while unfinished; he was ugly then; but when those muscles and joints were rendered capable of motion, it became a thing such as even Dante could not have conceived.

And that's pretty much it.  The "world will never be the same" scene, and the motivation for the following 19 chapters are left to the reader's imagination.
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Neonivek

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1166 on: November 06, 2015, 04:15:12 pm »

I will say that Frankenstien book confused me.

In that I didn't know if the doctor is meant to be in the right about basically destroying all hopes the monster ever had... or if he is meant to be the real villain and a unreliable narrator.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1167 on: November 06, 2015, 05:04:24 pm »

The Da Vinci Code depicts a massive global conspiracy to protect secrets that I can't imagine more than a handful of people in the entire world caring about. I can see in my mind's eye a news report doing a 30 second report on how some higher ups in the catholic heirarchy believe that Jesus had a kid or that such and such person may be his descendant, or that they equate the holy grail with Mary Magdaline, and I can see the person watching this news report flipping to a different channel before it's over.

There's also the issue that the protagonists apparently perceive the Catholic Church as having significant temporal power, despite the action taking place hundreds of years after the end of the middle-ages.
You forgot illerminatiiiii

And Catholic antimatter bomb

CATHOLIC ANTIMATTER BOMB

Starver

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1168 on: November 06, 2015, 05:57:04 pm »

CATHOLIC ANTIMATTER BOMB
Everyone is very careful to ensure that the Pope doesn't touch the Anti-Pope....
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Rolan7

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Re: Nitpicks that Ruined Movies
« Reply #1169 on: November 06, 2015, 06:08:47 pm »

Their love can never be... :'(
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