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[nenjin]

If by camo you mean painting them in the color of blood and entrails so they can blend into the piles of bodies they create, then yes, I paint mine for camo.

[Andres]

Thing is: humans turning into eldar-esque psykers would strengthen Chaos

At most it can be argued that they'd strengthen the power of the Warp in general, but not Chaos. It's canon that humanity will become better and kinder as they become more psychic, essentially becoming more like the Emperor. This makes sense because those who don't get corrupted/executed/both due to greater Chaos compatibility and those that remain and are more saintly will survive to reproduce. Since the Emperor is anathema to Chaos, humanity as a whole becoming more like the Emperor would only weaken Chaos.

the Emperor ascending into a full god would make him count as Chaos too...

You're assuming three things here.
1. That all gods are Chaos Gods. This is false, as the Eldar gods clearly attest.
2. That the Emperor would ascend to godhood rather than merely reincarnate like his past lives did countless times.
3. That attaining godhood is an "ascension". Humans are better than gods, the Emperor is proof of that. Him becoming a god would be descending into godhood.

Weren't there Men of Iron that got corrupted by Chaos?

Know one knows what made the Men of Iron rebel. Chaos is a popular theory but one that even those who theorise it admit it could very well be false. I personally don't believe that it was Chaos. Many might say that with Slaanesh's gestation Chaos would be active around this time, but this isn't actually the case. Up until the time when Slaanesh was actually and completely born, the Chaos gods hadn't really been doing anything. The most they could be noted for was that their daemons were a hazard in the Warp.

-Magnus finally gets over himself and saves humanity by powering the Golden Throne.

Impossible. Magnus' soul is gone. All that's left of him is the Daemon Primarch. The being now known as Magnus the Red is nothing but another one of Tzeentch's daemons and is thus a complete pawn of the Changer.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Given that Magnus literally spends all his time bitching about Tzeentch and planning revenge on the Space Wolves, I wonder. Hey, if Draigo could beat down Mortarion anything is possible.

[Andres]

Given that Magnus literally spends all his time bitching about Tzeentch and planning revenge on the Space Wolves, I wonder.

The daemon inherited Magnus' identity and memories and stuff, but the thing that made Magnus Magnus - his soul - is gone. Besides, planning and bitching about Tzeentch aren't exactly rare traits when it comes to Tzeentchian daemons.

Hey, if Draigo could beat down Mortarion anything is possible.

The original Ward rationalisation of "Draigo is just that badass" is stupid, but the more recent explanation actually makes sense: Draigo, the most skilled Grey Knight at the time, blasted Mortarion's true name (given by the Emperor himself) straight into the Daemon Primarch's mind. If there was ever anything that could allow Draigo to do what he did, that would be it.

[Rolepgeek]

Pretty sure blanks are still themselves, not nobodies. Ciaphas Cain novels seem to say so.

[Kot]

Some of you may remember I posted this last month:

I now want to make a forum game about a civvie surrounded by Chaos shit in a hive.

Get some *shudders slightly while still acknowledging the positives of the genre* survival game mechanics in there and add HERESY.

Ok, this gave me an idea. Not exactly this, though. What I have in mind is, since everyone is talking about heresy, a forum game where players control a group of Chaos cultists trying to take over a Hive (and later the planet). Don't know if players can RP individual cultists or if it's going to be just a suggestion-driven strategy game; it's late and I think I should leave such decisions to when I wake up.

Well, I got it all planned out now, pretty much. Want to gauge interest first, though, so I don't start it in vain. As an addendum, no RP stuff, purely an suggestion-driven strategy game.

Only if it's competetive forum stratedgy game and I can purge heretics.

[Andres]

Pretty sure blanks are still themselves, not nobodies. Ciaphas Cain novels seem to say so.

So there are two real Magnuses?

[Rolepgeek]

Sure?

There's about a hundred quadrillion real Khornes. Every Khornate Daemon is a sliver of him, after all.

Or, if you wanna look at it another way, Magnus became a Daemon Prince. He's still Magnus, and he can still put aside that power if he chose to. Or not, and just power the Golden Throne in Daemon Prince form. *shrug*

[pisskop]

yea but his soul is kaput.  not sure you can call what was barely human before, and what was the least human of the barely human testtube babies, human  or in any way aligned to humans now that the only human part of him is a distant memory of beung an outcast and pariah

[pisskop]

like is magnus even capable if rebelling from Tzeentch now?

Or is it a paradox to try

[Frumple]

If he's aligned with tzeentch it would probably be a paradox if he wasn't. Thing's whole shtick is mostly inimical to that kind of thing. One of the other three might be able to work it but the changer having a daemon prince unable to change is... not something that makes too much sense. Probably all sorts of reasons why the guy won't or wouldn't, but can't doesn't seem likely.

[Grim Portent]

Daemons, especially Princes, are free agents of a sort, able to pursue their own goals even at the expense of their god but ultimately a lesser reflection of the forces that form the deity. Skarbrand is the ultimate example of this, having tried to slay Khorne himself. There are also a few tales of Slaaneshi daemons that did things against their lord's wishes and were punished for it, most notably the gardeners who he turned into statues for neglecting their duties in favour of going into battle with their daemonic grinder/lawnmowers.

If Magnus really wanted to he could rebel against Tzeentch much as Skarbrand once did to Khorne, though he would certainly fail as Skarbrand did. He cannot willingly set aside his daemonic powers, they can only be taken from him by Tzeentch himself.

It is worth noting that the way souls are described in most 40k depictions makes them sound nearly identical to daemons, a force of psychic energy binding together a collection of memories and personality traits. Powerful souls can persist in the Warp for a time, and daemons stripped of power by their god dissolve back into the Warp as their personality fades away without power to keep it together, much as mortals do when they die and enter the Warp. Though most souls get forcibly stripped of power by daemons when they enter the Warp rather than dissolving into it peacefully these days.

[Rolepgeek]

And remember that Magnus was supposed to be second in power only to the Emperor, essentially.

That's why he could have powered the Golden Throne.

So it's not like he's gonna be shredded by a few thousand years of brand loyalty.

Maybe a bit scarred, but I mean really now. He might not succeed in rebelling directly against Tzeentch, but I'd say 'power the golden throne, let the Empy get on his feet' is a pretty decent form of rebellion. He already showed once how he gets along with his father figures. "I was just trying to help, Dad!" "No, son, you are ground for until college; tying your note to a rock and throwing it through my office window is not appropriate behavior" "But Dad! Read it! You'll see why!" "No, son. Go to your room." "YOU NEVER LOVED ME"

[pisskop]

I am continuously amazed that w40k isnt a daytime soap opera.

  -This time on 'Days of Our Primarchs', Is Horus cheating on Big E?  Brotherhood betrayal from Fulgrim, Vulcan loses his children, and Magnus makes a desperate plea for attention, but will it be enough?

[misko27]

A soul is just a mass of warp energy, after all. The difference is that a soul is a coherent whole, an internally consistent thing; whereas demons have just pure warp energy in the form of a soul. They both serve the same purpose, but an actual soul is very stable, whereas the masses of warp energy are not, but also then not checked by the limits of a single soul. So demons have much more powerful, but much less stable souls.

I wonder if Magnus's soul is still out there, waiting to be reclaimed.

So it's not like he's gonna be shredded by a few thousand years of brand loyalty.

Probably not, but the whole "betray Chaos, and specifically betray the Changer of Ways and his future-seeing birdman" is a pretty rough time. Plus he's probably still very conflicted in his feelings for the Imperium; it's one thing to hate chaos, but another thing to actively want to support the Imperium while still believing that the Emperor ordered Prospero burned.

I am continuously amazed that w40k isnt a daytime soap opera.

  -This time on 'Days of Our Primarchs', Is Horus cheating on Big E?  Brotherhood betrayal from Fulgrim, Vulcan loses his children, and Magnus makes a desperate plea for attention, but will it be enough?

The title should be "As the Galaxy turns burns", with "Days of our Primarchs" the season title.