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I am religious and believe in free will

70 (27.6%)

I am religious and do not believe in free will

10 (3.9%)

I am not religious and believe in free will

113 (44.5%)

I am not religious and do not believe in free will

61 (24%)

Total Members Voted: 249

[MonkeyHead]

I was just pointing out what the Bible says.

That does not make it any less unpleasant, especially when we have had another Christian on the forums arguing that the Bible can not be used to discriminate.

[Descan]

And Mein Kampf says the Jews are evil and that the French are mongrel half-bloods. Just because a book says something (and says the idea is from God himself) doesn't make it true.

[/Godwin]

[origamiscienceguy]

I was just pointing out what the Bible says.

That does not make it any less unpleasant.

I'm sorry that life is unpleasant. That is something everybody has to deal with.

[MonkeyHead]

I was just pointing out what the Bible says.

That does not make it any less unpleasant.

I'm sorry that life is unpleasant. That is something everybody has to deal with.

Life is not "unpleasant". Life just "is". Labelling someone as despised by your god makes it more unpleasant than it should be. Acting based on that faith based belief makes it unpleasant for those on the end of it. Having to defend themselves from faith based accusations of this nature - that is something people should NOT have to deal with. Those of us that do not share your faith are dealing with it, by making life more pleasant for those you would marginalise with your views. That is something you are going to have to deal with.

[origamiscienceguy]

I did make a mistake in what I said. I meant to say that God hates Adultery and Homosexuality as the sin rather than the people. God loves the people, but hates the sin. Hopefully that clears things up

[scrdest]

God hates Adultery and Homosexuality as the sin

Which quote you're basing that on?

[MonkeyHead]

I did make a mistake in what I said. I meant to say that God hates Adultery and Homosexuality as the sin rather than the people. God loves the people, but hates the sin. Hopefully that clears things up

It does. Thank you for the clarification. I would still find it hard to accept that faith based stance as one to form social constructs such as laws on, but it is much less offensive than the way it seemed.

[origamiscienceguy]

God hates Adultery and Homosexuality as the sin

Which quote you're basing that on?

Genesis 2:24: "Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and cleaves to his wife, and they become one flesh."
This states how marriage should be done. He speaks about homosexuality in several places:
Leviticus 18:22, "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination."

1 Corinthians 6:9-10, "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God."

Romans 1:26-28, "For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error. And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper."

God makes his point about adultery clearly in the ten commandments:
Exodus 20:14, "You shall not commit adultery"

[Orange Wizard]

Well that very nearly exploded. Thanks for keeping it in hand, chaps.

[TD1]

I very much doubt that Adam and Eve were married, unless God presided over that himself. And he had fallen out with them before they even thought of squeezing out children.
Were they sinning?
Was God sinning when he got Mary pregnant? I don't think it says in the bible that god didn't do it physically.

Also, I repeat, the bible's stance on homosexuality is obviously a reflecion of the times just as the whole not eating pork thing was. Should we not eat pork?

[scrdest]

Furthermore, that Genesis quote does not preclude multiple wives - and indeed, people in the Old Testament times would marry polygamously and have concubines all the damn time if they had the resources and will to do so, and Salomon in particular allegedly had more wives and concubines than some people meet in a lifetime and God didn't get pissy until he used a very underhanded method of getting another one.

[origamiscienceguy]

I very much doubt that Adam and Eve were married, unless God presided over that himself. And he had fallen out with them before they even thought of squeezing out children.
Were they sinning?
Was God sinning when he got Mary pregnant? I don't think it says in the bible that god didn't do it physically.

Also, I repeat, the bible's stance on homosexuality is obviously a reflecion of the times just as the whole not eating pork thing was. Should we not eat pork?

Adam and Eve were married. God gave Eve to Adam as a wife.

God didn't "do it" with Mary either. God put Jesus in the womb.

Read Acts 10:9-16. In summary, god doesn't care about unclean animals anymore.

Furthermore, that Genesis quote does not preclude multiple wives - and indeed, people in the Old Testament times would marry polygamously and have concubines all the damn time if they had the resources and will to do so, and Salomon in particular allegedly had more wives and concubines than some people meet in a lifetime and God didn't get pissy until he used a very underhanded method of getting another one.

God didn't design men to be married with multiple wives. Every time they did, they were sinning. Actually, Solomon's multitude of wives was his downfall.

[TD1]

And my father put me in the womb too.

Also, they weren't married unless you believe it's possible without a marriage.

[origamiscienceguy]

Also, they weren't married unless you believe it's possible without a marriage.

Can you please clarify? I don't understand what you're saying here

[Orange Wizard]

He's saying that for Adam and Eve to be married, there should have been a wedding. Which, to be fair, there is not.