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Author Topic: Wands Race - [Arstotzka] {COMPLETED}  (Read 376911 times)

10ebbor10

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #165 on: March 24, 2017, 07:31:05 am »

Turn 1 was a bust for them?

I must say, I hadn't noticed. They appeared to be doing quite well then actually, while we got absolutely nothing despite rolling only half as much 1's.
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Iituem

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #166 on: March 24, 2017, 08:00:45 am »

Forenia, 915

Harsh weather persists in the southern mountains, and hard fighting at the foothills remains confined to the border.  No major losses are reported, but neither are any territorial gains.  Moskurgers fail to take back any ground at the deadly Krozkan Pass beneath the castle promised to their now-Queen, but neither can the Arstotzkans push past the last line of border forts to reach the desert.  The Moskurgers seemed inspired, partially by their commitment to chivalry and honour, and partly by the presence of none other than the Sun Hammer himself, al-Mutriqa, who leads the defence.


The jungles see a slow push backwards for Arstotzka.  As before, neither side conclusively wins most skirmishes, but Moskurg manages to pull through in a few crucial battles and takes a vital fort on the way to the last major Arstotzkan encampment.  Further victory may well lead to Moskurger control over the jungle.

Fighting hasn't changed much here in the jungle, but we have noticed a key difference.  The Moskurger wizards and some of their knights are now seemingly surrounded by a sort of shield composed of fast-moving air that deflects arrows and blows.  The shield only seems limited to two targets at most, and up close it is less useful, but it is stopping our snipers from taking out their wizards at a distance and might pose problems if we ever try to assassinate their leaderhsip.  The good news is, they still can't get close enough to read our thoughts without getting into range for our arrows to overcome those shields of theirs by sheer number.  Myark remains present, keeping the enemy at bay.

Additionally, many of our troops were captured in the siege of our fort.  We were readying to ransom them back when they were returned to us, relieved of weapons and armour, having already been cared for by Moskurger healers.  Ready, once re-equipped, to go straight back into the field.


In the plains, the Moskurg advantage is pressed home with heavy reinforcement.  Arstotzkan light troops are now essentially unable to compete in plains skirmishes, being eliminated with cold efficiency by horse archers and hidden Moskurger shortbowmen.  Groups of stragglers are wiped out by teams of a dozen squads, converging from seemingly random positions on isolated enemies.  Nowhere is this more deadly or apparent than in massed battle, where Moskurger light infantry move in terrifyingly co-ordinated formations, whilst archers and horse archers encircle, trap and flank with inhuman ability.  Moskurg wins every major engagement, pressing back against Arstotzkan troops until they reach the border forts, then taking those as well.

Moskurg holds the plains.  If they can hold them for another turn, they will achieve control.

This proved to be a disaster, much of which we attribute to the Moskurger battle co-ordination.  They seem to be able to coordinate troop movements far faster and more efficiently than drums and runners should be able to manage.  We've seen this sort of co-ordination before, but only during skirmishes, a few squads at a time.  We put it down to concealed messengers or visual signals before, but on this scale there must be some sort of magical assistance.  Some of the Moskurg success may be put down to luck, however.

We lost a lot of troops.  Between Moskurger prisoner management and ransoms for the less salubrious captors, we were able to repatriate a full army's worth of soldiers, but we lost twice that.  Probably for the best that we have so much extra resupply.


At sea, the future remains muddy and uncertain.  In the eastern sea, Moskurger forces take back the portion of coast that the Arstotzkans took last year, sinking a number of haboured ships in the process.


We lost about five armies' worth of troops and ships this year, two of which we got back due to ransoms and chivalry.  With our reinforcements, this is neither a net gain or loss for us.  The King replenishes the forces lost.


Decision Time:  Arstotzka has adopted Pragmatism, Moskurg has adopted Chivalry.

Revision Credit:  A cultured scholar, Jibril Saadiya, has come to the isle of Forenia, having heard rumours of magic.  He claims to be a mystic and alchemist, and whilst you have doubts about that he certainly seems sharp and would be a welcome addition to your design team.  He appears to be a Saracen and consequently enjoys culture, entertainment and erudition.  The nation that is the most cultured, entertaining or erudite will attract this scholar and his keen mind.

It is 915, the Design Phase.

Spoiler: State of Forenia, 915 (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Arstotzkan Equipment (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Arstotzkan Elite Units (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Arstotzkan Spells (click to show/hide)

Turn 1 was a bust for them?
I must say, I hadn't noticed. They appeared to be doing quite well then actually, while we got absolutely nothing despite rolling only half as much 1's.

They had a major bug to one of their enchantments which caused their mages to go mad and die, took them two turns to fix, imposed morale penalties the whole time that cancelled out the benefits they were getting.
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10ebbor10

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #167 on: March 24, 2017, 08:16:10 am »

Quote
They had a major bug to one of their enchantments which caused their mages to go mad and die, took them two turns to fix, imposed morale penalties the whole time that cancelled out the benefits they were getting.

Cancelled out their benefits? They used it perfectly effectively to destroy our forces in the Jungle and plains.

Anyway, we're losing heavily now. Because we failed to do anything last turn, everything is even more screwed up than it was before, and stuff was screwed then too.

The problem is that the enemy has spells that negate ours completely, for far lower cost and design issues than ours.

Their gust of wind stops 3 of our spells on it's own, their starting spells basically negated 1. Incidentally, I've got the feeling that our very expensive web spell is pretty much useless, while their very expensive mind reading spell completely dominated the battlefield. I mean, despite the fact that we're supposed to have a spell that allows us to kill our enemies easier, they have always inflicted more losses on us.

Are there any areas in which we were better?

Because honestly, as far as I can see the battlefield was heavily tilted against us from the start.

We were supposed to be the nation that was stronger in Skirmishing, but the Moskurgians did better than us there. We were supposed to be the nation that was better in routing their forces, but they did better than us there. In the mainline too, the Moskurgians reign supreme. And now even at Sea, where our fireballs should allow us to win easily, they're gaining terrain.

In my opinion, the initial status was not balanced at all. Moskurgian mind readers dominated the battlefield, Moskurgian ambush detectors detected our magical ambushes (despite the description explicitedly saying that they shouldn't), Moskurgian archery is completely unaffected by mist that should hinder them.

Oh, and Moskurgian cavalry has been annoying us for ages, while ours hasn't even been mentioned yet.


Anyway, we need something to blow up lots of Moskurgians at once, and deal with their horse archers.

Inferno :

A modification of the fireball spell, intended to be cheaper and easier to cast. Inferno does not throw fireballs per se, but rather causes massive fires to erupt surrounding the enemy lines. Magical fire, that springs up under their feet, so that their wind spells don't stop it too. Horses are afraid of fire, and the formations they favor should easily find themselves surrounded by escalating brush fires.

Do please inform us if this would attract some penalty for one reason or the other.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2017, 08:42:40 am by 10ebbor10 »
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Iituem

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #168 on: March 24, 2017, 08:55:03 am »

Their gust of wind stops 3 of our spells on it's own, their starting spells basically negated 1. Incidentally, I've got the feeling that our very expensive web spell is pretty much useless, while their very expensive mind reading spell completely dominated the battlefield. I mean, despite the fact that we're supposed to have a spell that allows us to kill our enemies easier, they have always inflicted more losses on us.

Are there any areas in which we were better?

Because honestly, as far as I can see the battlefield was heavily tilted against us from the start.

We were supposed to be the nation that was stronger in Skirmishing, but the Moskurgians did better than us there. We were supposed to be the nation that was better in routing their forces, but they did better than us there. In the mainline too, the Moskurgians reign supreme. And now even at Sea, where our fireballs should allow us to win easily, they're gaining terrain.

In my opinion, the initial status was not balanced at all. Moskurgian mind readers dominated the battlefield, Moskurgian ambush detectors detected our magical ambushes (despite the description explicitedly saying that they shouldn't), Moskurgian archery is completely unaffected by mist that should hinder them.

Oh, and Moskurgian cavalry has been annoying us for ages, while ours hasn't even been mentioned yet.

- Moskurg was never able to detect your magical traps with their detect traps spell; that was a duff interpretation on my part to demonstrate their mind reading, but I realise it sounded like their spell was overbuffed.
- Mind Reading cancelled officer bonuses, but could be stopped with bodyguards on thanes - which you did.  Your elite witch hunters provide a bodyguard bonus that negates mind reading whilst also applying a penalty to all spell support, which forced Moskurg to research their own bodyguard spell.  Unfortunately I didn't communicate this too well because I don't like to be too explicit to either side as to potential counters to leave room for creative solutions.
- Web was underpowered, it gave you a big bonus to the Rout phase but that phase doesn't tend to contribute to battle success, rather driving home victory.  I've halved the bonus and applied it to both Rout and Skirmish now, (+1 to both instead of +2 to one) since that's actually more in line with what a Very Expensive spell should be.  That's a balance problem from me, my bad.
- Obscuring mist has been giving you a skirmish bonus (attack and defence) since day 1, in line with a 'common' spell.  They didn't figure out how to defeat that for several turns.
- Fireball gave a flat bonus to melee, counted double on the attack with a bonus to offensive skirmish.  Heroism had a similar bonus set, but balanced as an attack/defence bonus with no benefit to aggression or defensiveness.

In terms of initial setup, both sides had equal skirmish bonuses with Moskurg's weighted towards the jungle and Arstotzka's to the mountains.  Neither side had officer bonuses in the jungle, whilst you had officer bonuses based out of mountains and they had officer bonuses based out of plains.  Equally, I gave Arstotzka better general melee stats (with a slight edge in the mountains and jungles, both where their infantry fight better) with Moskurg having melee bonuses that applied to the plains (formation and numbers).

Overall, I have tried to keep things balanced but admit fault on poor descriptions of circumstances.  I have rebalanced a few spells to even things out; Web now applies skirmish bonuses instead of (less useful) heavy rout bonuses, the Fireball wand (and reverse engineered spell) has been strengthened accordingly.

With a mind to redressing disadvantage over time, I will apply a morale bonus to all Arstotzkan troops next turn, since I did cock up on the balance for the initial spells.
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10ebbor10

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #169 on: March 24, 2017, 08:57:24 am »

Okay, thanks.

Sorry if I sound harsh, but you get kind of involved in these things.
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Iituem

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #170 on: March 24, 2017, 08:59:28 am »

Not a problem, the initial spells were my responsibility to balance; I spent half a day on the troops, but I statted the spells quickly because I didn't know what people were going to pick (and statting eight spellbooks and eight wands would have been insane).
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10ebbor10

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #171 on: March 24, 2017, 09:22:51 am »

Anyway, for ideas.

Inferno :

A modification of the big fireball spell, intended to be cheaper and easier to cast. Inferno does not throw fireballs per se, but rather causes massive fires to erupt surrounding the enemy lines. Magical fire, that springs up under their feet, so that their wind spells don't stop it too. Horses are afraid of fire, and the formations they favor should easily find themselves surrounded by escalating brush fires.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2017, 10:42:23 am by 10ebbor10 »
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stabbymcstabstab

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #172 on: March 24, 2017, 10:27:59 am »

Anyway, for ideas.

Inferno :

A modification of the fireball spell, intended to be cheaper and easier to cast. Inferno does not throw fireballs per se, but rather causes massive fires to erupt surrounding the enemy lines. Magical fire, that springs up under their feet, so that their wind spells don't stop it too. Horses are afraid of fire, and the formations they favor should easily find themselves surrounded by escalating brush fires.
+1 Ill support this, this should also make burning ships up much easier.
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Roboson

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #173 on: March 24, 2017, 11:04:46 am »

I think we need something to dig in and really try and hold our position in the plains. I mean like some trench warfare level of shit, otherwise we're going to get pushed out this turn. Inferno seems like another offensive spell, but we really need a defensive spell at this point as were getting pushed in both the jungle and the plains. Is there a way we can revise it to slightly be more defensive?

Also, is it just me, or do they have radios? I'm reading back through the updates and I'm basically certain they invented radios so their squads can coordinate better than ours. That or like magic mirrors that let them facetime via magic.
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stabbymcstabstab

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #174 on: March 24, 2017, 11:06:29 am »

Hmm, maybe? We could try something similar.
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OceanSoul

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #175 on: March 24, 2017, 11:14:24 am »

One-way glass that conjures the image of the person on another one-way glass?
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10ebbor10

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #176 on: March 24, 2017, 11:15:24 am »

I think we need something to dig in and really try and hold our position in the plains.

We don't have a position in the plains. We got pushed out. The Moskurgians conquered 2 units of territory at once, and now we need to attack to take it back.


One-way glass that conjures the image of the person on another one-way glass?

We're on the back foot. Now is not the time for Wunderwaffen.

Stay with what we know. Don't attract minuses.


But if you want a more defensive spell

Wall of fire

This spell summons a massive wall of fire in whatever shape the wizard who casts it desires. It can be used to protect friendly lines, funnel enemy forces or surround and burn up enemy ambushes. Expense is aimed at being at worst very expensive. The fire is magical, and thus won't do stupid things like being blown out by a bit of wind.


Speaking about attracting damaging side effects, I have decided to make my voted action less ambitious.

Wand of Fire

A second attempt to reverse engineer the wand of fire. The idea of this wand, made of alloys strong enough to sustain great amount of heats without burning the wielder, is to make it much easier and cheaper to cast the fireball spells that make up our primary arsenal. With the new wands, one no longer needs to be a master to cast the spell, allowing a much greater concentration of firepower.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2017, 11:26:55 am by 10ebbor10 »
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FallacyofUrist

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #177 on: March 24, 2017, 11:42:55 am »

Wall of fire

This spell summons a massive wall of fire in whatever shape the wizard who casts it desires. It can be used to protect friendly lines, funnel enemy forces or surround and burn up enemy ambushes. Expense is aimed at being at worst very expensive. The fire is magical, and thus won't do stupid things like being blown out by a bit of wind.
+1
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Roboson

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #178 on: March 24, 2017, 11:50:00 am »

I think we need something to dig in and really try and hold our position in the plains.

We don't have a position in the plains. We got pushed out. The Moskurgians conquered 2 units of territory at once, and now we need to attack to take it back.


Wow, didn't even know it was possible to take two units of territory at once.


I can get behind (official vote) wall of fire, but its likely that will get countered in the coming turns as they upgrade their wind spells. Honestly I'd prefer something to counter their new archers (which despite being not magical, are kicking our asses. Shout out to what could have been pikes) or something to counter their ability to coordinate their troops. But it looks like this turn fire wall has overwhelming support.

Honestly, if we can get a magic communications scrambler up and running, that will destroy their advantage. Food for thought later.


Edit: now that webs are going to be more useful in skirmishes and combat, we could reopen the razor web concept. Who knows, maybe RAM was on the right track with buffing our wizardite... still going to vote for armor revision though.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2017, 11:54:34 am by Roboson »
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10ebbor10

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Re: Wands Race - Design Phase 914 [Arstotzka]
« Reply #179 on: March 24, 2017, 11:53:13 am »

Quote
Shout out to what could have been pikes

Pikes would not have done that. Your plate mail could have done it, I believe. I would very much like to revise that into functionality this turn.

Do note however, that we got a double walloping this turn. We were lucky last turn, they got the expense credit (which should expire now, so that should help), and we accomplished nothing.

That was a whole lot of failure accumulating.

On a side note, should we move our master wizard to the plains. Could loose us the Jungle, but could also push the Moskurgians back.
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