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I am religious and believe in free will

70 (27.6%)

I am religious and do not believe in free will

10 (3.9%)

I am not religious and believe in free will

113 (44.5%)

I am not religious and do not believe in free will

61 (24%)

Total Members Voted: 249

[origamiscienceguy]

God very easily could have planned and or shaped this evolution and would still be ultimately be responsible for any life that appeared, or the universe that created and housed them.

That is something I haven't heard before. I choose to believe that God made most animals, plants, etc basically how they were today, and evolution made only slight changes to divide them into individual species. Humans and apes were created separately during the creation. And we were made in the image of God.

[itisnotlogical]

If we were made literally in the image of God, as in we look like God looks, then that'd mean God is a mortal human being with human features. The interpretation that I usually hear is that "in the image of God" means that we have a great spiritual capacity, including self-awareness, love, a soul, etc.

[Quartz_Mace]

Well scientific evidence tells us that there were millions of years before life we would even recognize existed on Earth, it's honestly true that God could have faked all the fossils and rock layers he wanted to throw us off(though I doubt this is the case, I honestly believe it's possible). If we were made in the image of God, I think it's more in the sense that we are capable of thinking, reasoning, creating, and doing things instead of being a carbon copy of His physical form. For example, I'd hazard a guess that God wouldn't have a reproductive system in physical form (except as Jesus), as our reproductive systems are our means of reproducing, whereas God can make whatever He wants without sexual reproduction.

Somewhat Ninja'd

Edit Note: I find it extremely unlikely that the Earth's history was faked by God. I'm merely stating that it's within His realm of possibility. I still would probably bet all of my worldly possessions that we evolved from single-called organisms and dinosaurs existed etc.

[Loud Whispers]

Nah m8 it's fractals all the way down and up and beyond

[TheDarkStar]

Nah m8 it's fractals all the way down and up and beyond

Oddly enough, this matches my beliefs more than Quartz's comments.

And about the "made in God's image" thing, I think that evolution happens and God created a universe with the proper conditions for it but he also directs things along the way. And I believe that people are physically (not just mentally/spiritually) made in God's  image (although my ideas about the nature of God differ from most Christians, since I believe that there are three separate beings rather than a trinity and that the Father and Son have physical bodies, with the Spirit still a spirit).

[smirk]

God very easily could have planned and or shaped this evolution and would still be ultimately be responsible for any life that appeared, or the universe that created and housed them.

That is something I haven't heard before. I choose to believe that God made most animals, plants, etc basically how they were today, and evolution made only slight changes to divide them into individual species. Humans and apes were created separately during the creation. And we were made in the image of God.

As with all important things, the answer lies in Filk.

[Rolepgeek]

Well scientific evidence tells us that there were millions of years before life we would even recognize existed on Earth, it's honestly true that God could have faked all the fossils and rock layers he wanted to throw us off(though I doubt this is the case, I honestly believe it's possible). If we were made in the image of God, I think it's more in the sense that we are capable of thinking, reasoning, creating, and doing things instead of being a carbon copy of His physical form. For example, I'd hazard a guess that God wouldn't have a reproductive system in physical form (except as Jesus), as our reproductive systems are our means of reproducing, whereas God can make whatever He wants without sexual reproduction.

Somewhat Ninja'd

Edit Note: I find it extremely unlikely that the Earth's history was faked by God. I'm merely stating that it's within His realm of possibility. I still would probably bet all of my worldly possessions that we evolved from single-called organisms and dinosaurs existed etc.

tfw you realize that, going off the old testament, god's actually kind of a dick, but when he knocked up Mary, figured he had to try and be a good dad. Jesus reformed God.

[TD1]

God very easily could have planned and or shaped this evolution and would still be ultimately be responsible for any life that appeared, or the universe that created and housed them.

That is something I haven't heard before. I choose to believe that God made most animals, plants, etc basically how they were today, and evolution made only slight changes to divide them into individual species. Humans and apes were created separately during the creation. And we were made in the image of God.

As with all important things, the answer lies in Filk.

It's sad that I knew what the song would be before I clicked it.

As for evolution, if pain is god's megaphone for a deaf word, and he uses it like a chisel forming a statue (for our own good) then why can't evolution (the physical manifestation of the changes hardship brings to bear on a species) be the process by which we see the statue created. Of course, given that it's likely all animals came from the same place, the other animals we see are the ones who have not yet been so well formed. As such, when God saw us creeping along a fairly accurate trajectory towards His image he decided to intervene with the bible and such.

Not saying I believe it, I'm just being...uh... God's Advocate.

[Putnam]

god has some frigging explaining to do in that case

[Orange Wizard]

As for evolution, if pain is god's megaphone for a deaf word, and he uses it like a chisel forming a statue (for our own good) then why can't evolution (the physical manifestation of the changes hardship brings to bear on a species) be the process by which we see the statue created. Of course, given that it's likely all animals came from the same place, the other animals we see are the ones who have not yet been so well formed. As such, when God saw us creeping along a fairly accurate trajectory towards His image he decided to intervene with the bible and such.

Not saying I believe it, I'm just being...uh... God's Advocate.

I think you'll find a large number of Christians these days believe something along those lines. "Evolution's just the way God gets things done", etc.

god has some frigging explaining to do in that case

Yeah, there's a lot of flaws with human bodies and such. Like the blind spot, or telomeres decaying, or... sin.

[Putnam]

sin was a concept that people came up with from back when dualism was still the generally accepted explanation for consciousness and you know it buddy, can't really theologically say that it's a flaw of this mortal flesh when souls are supposed to exist

[Orange Wizard]

To be fair, most of the Biblical support for souls consists of people using the word soul, which more-or-less means "inmost being", rather than "magical spirit doodad that follows you around or something".

And even then, the Bible consistently ascribes sin to the body, not the soul. Except under Calvinism the soul is also corrupt.

IMO the best interpretation is that the soul is part of (or at least fundamentally connected to) the body; which is imperfect because/therefore sin is a thing. The soul isn't a separate dohickey, and there's not really any reason for it to be a supernatural thing anyway.

E: Kinda rambly. It's late, sue me.

[Egan_BW]

The way I see it, it's fairly observable that the soul/spirit/mind is a thing that lives in the brain, not outside the body. Though that does raise the question of how your soul would end up in heaven when your brain is destroyed. I suppose it's not impossible that god simply scans your brain at the moment of death...

[TD1]

That's the thing about religious theory. None of it's impossible - nothing is - it's just improbable.

Yes, I know I've said that ten thousand times. To quote OW, "sue me"

[TempAcc]

The bible does almost nothing to describe what the soul is supposed to be, it just gives out an idea of something that inherent to all people but at the same time separate from the body and that remains after death. The soul isn't isn't described as being somewhere within the body, either, at least not in the bible, AFAIK.