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[Scripten]

Fix up the platforming, make the combat a bit more technical, and fix the weapons... then I wouldn't be as cheesed.

Okay, this is probably a bad idea, but I legitimately curious. What do you actually expect?

1) Fix up the platforming : What about the platforming is wrong? Do you feel like it is too floaty? Do you dislike the utility items? Is the jump height too low? I've honestly never had a problem with the way SB controls. The inputs felt responsive and, as far as platforming is concerned, I've never felt like the game cheated me due to control issues. Is that bare minimum? Maybe, but this is not a game made in the image of the classic Sonic games or Dustforce/Super Meat Boy/etc.

2) Make the combat a bit more technical : In what way? Currently, there is an expectation for timing, placement, and the like. You certainly can't stand still and button mash. (There are also a number of fixes and changes detailed in the newest blog post that solve several other annoyances I've seen aired in this thread.) I will admit that Terraria has more robust combat... when you are fighting bosses, due to the attack patterns of the bosses as opposed to the combat mechanics. Are you comparing SB against other combat platformers? Which ones, and in which ways are they technically superior?

2) Fix the weapons : How? Special attacks? Unique properties? Varied gameplay styles? These are all currently part of the mechanics. What are they missing, in your opinion?

I'm also very curious to see a comparison of the features coming to 1.0 or already in the game with the original roadmap. I know someone must have preserved it. Using my advanced Google-fu, I've grabbed a couple of links:

Old Destructoid article with some mock-up pictures and features
Wiki pages for the roadmap (Is this the same as the original roadmap? Looks familiar to me, tbh)

FAKEEDIT: Aha, found it: The actual roadmap, pickled on Reddit

I would do a quick rundown of the features in the current version of the game and those detailed in the 1.0 blog post, but I really just don't have the time nor inclination. From a quick skim, I don't think anything is missing from the game? Maybe the security stuff, since I haven't tried doing anything complicated with cheating or running a server. Barring that, I don't know what massive compromises have been made during development.

About all I can tell is that people are angry that the game took too long and that CF has maintained an echo box on their personal forums. Am I missing something big?

[Greenbane]

Fix up the platforming, make the combat a bit more technical, and fix the weapons... then I wouldn't be as cheesed.

So it comes down to that. The little subjective things. I didn't even know platforming had a problem, for example. For all that rage, I thought you had more fundamental issues with the game itself.

So 1.0 is coming soon. Some people will like it. Some won't. Story of every game ever.

Nowhere near the Towns, Spacebase DF-9 or Windborne disaster.

(snip)

I'm still genuinely waiting for someone to tell me what Starbound was allegedly supposed to be and how now it isn't or possibly won't be by 1.0.


PS: Thanks, Scripten. Will look into it later.

...but the links' formatting is rather messed up. Needs some polish.

[MaximumZero]

You know, I honestly don't give a damn what Starbound was supposed to be. Sure, some people banked on dev speculation and high hopes, but in the end, I got $15 worth of fun out of it, so I guess I'm pretty happy with what I got. Games aren't investments that are promising specific returns on investment. Sometimes games just aren't what you think they're going to be, and sometimes they just flat out suck. I should know, I work for the largest games retailer in the world. Either way, if you managed to wring enough fun out of what you did play to cover the cost of admission, maybe it would be better suited to focus on something that made you happy instead of being irrationally angry that you didn't get (or only got) $400 worth of fun for $10 or however much you paid in. I imagine that the people who actually paid for the development of Duke Nukem Forever (which I still sell copies of, btw,) are pretty pissed off at the product that they got, but they didn't sit and stew endlessly, they moved on to different projects, and if you don't like what Starbound offers because it isn't exactly what the devs wanted in the beginning, maybe you should, too.

[Neonivek]

You know, I honestly don't give a damn what Starbound was supposed to be.

Look, if you are allowed to be happy with Starbound.

I am allowed to be dissatisfied with Starbound.

You had your grace "It might get better" period where people could deflect criticism based on its unfinished state. That period is over.

[Mephisto]

You know, I honestly don't give a damn what Starbound was supposed to be.

Look, if you are allowed to be happy with Starbound.

I am allowed to be dissatisfied with Starbound.

You had your grace "It might get better" period where people could deflect criticism based on its unfinished state. That period is over.

IOW:

"If you're allowed to vent irrationally about video games. Others are allowed to react to said venting."

That's how discussions work.

[Neonivek]

IOW:

"If you're allowed to vent irrationally about video games. Others are allowed to react to said venting."

That's how discussions work.

Yeah, but none of this "You aren't supposed to be mad!"

[Dorsidwarf]

Starbound is a pretty neat game.

Star-bound was the most-hyped indie game ever until NMS.

Starbounds development process has been murky, with constant design direction changes and poor communication from devs.

Starbound is not as good a game as a lot of people hoped and expected.

This makes some people sad or angry.

Personally I had lots of fun with Starbound, but I feel disappointed it wasn't what it could have been.

[Greenbane]

IOW:

"If you're allowed to vent irrationally about video games. Others are allowed to react to said venting."

That's how discussions work.

Yeah, but none of this "You aren't supposed to be mad!"

It's all opinions. I'm just trying to find out just what's so heinous about Starbound, and why people are so hung up over 15 dollars they spent years ago, out of which they already got dozens of hours of entertainment. But MaximumZero put it pretty eloquently: when you invest on something like a videogame so early on in its development process, there's a fair chance it won't turn out according to your dreams.

Because we're really just talking about hopes and dreams here: there isn't really much of importance missing, when you compare the original concept and ideas (which Scripten helpfully linked to just now) with the current state of the game. In fact, in some aspects the game's currently greater than what was originally planned (number and variety of dungeons per planet, for instance).

[Neonivek]

So you wouldn't mind Greenbane if I told you that you should hate the game and that by liking it you are delusional and just making excuses to make yourself happy with your purchase? AKA: Sweet Lemons?

Ohh wait, that would make me a total ass.

[Darkmere]

So, looking over the old road map linked a page or two ago, it does look like the stuff made it in, in one form or another.

Did anyone ever come up with concrete stuff that was 100% said "yeah bro this is gonna be there" and never was? I skimmed a few of the old IRC logs and haven't found an outright failure to deliver yet, aside from stuff like "you can paint  your guns".

Note the employee practices are still shit, but I'm just asking about the game right now. The IRC chats are copy/pasted into this forum's old thread, and reddit has that roadmap archive. What, specifically, is AWOL here?

[Greenbane]

So you wouldn't mind Greenbane if I told you that you should hate the game and that by liking it you are delusional and just making excuses to make yourself happy with your purchase? AKA: Sweet Lemons?

Ohh wait, that would make me a total ass.

I never told anyone they should like the game or that they're delusional for not liking it. You keep acting as if I'm trying to force people to feel this or that way. That's not how internet discussions work.

As I said, I'm just trying to understand what's Starbound's major war crime, and why some feel such virulent hatred for it. It turns out that, for many, including yourself, it merely could've been better. There is no major war crime, no major promise left unfulfilled. Just personal expectations not met.

In the end you're only guaranteed a full game made with a certain concept in mind, and nobody can assure you you'll like it. Some will, some won't. That's normal for any game.

[NullForceOmega]

The issue really has very little to do with the game, many people are dissatisfied with the game because it doesn't meet their expectations of 'Terraria in space but better' which is what Tiy hyped it as, and was generally believed that could be done because he already had experience from Terraria under his belt (we didn't really find out until afterwards that he didn't really get game design and development.)  What really pisses people off is the Chucklefish team basically being trolling asshats who promised the moon (and they really did) and delivered salt flats.  And don't get me started on gods damned horsetits.

I've dropped around 200 hours into Starbound, and while there were definite periods where I had fun, almost all of the fun I had came from modding the game into something almost unrecognizable.  So I'm not going to say I didn't get enjoyment time out of it, but I fully understand why people (and occasionally myself) get so irate over it.

[Gentlefish]

...Personally, the only thing I wish I could have (and could probably easily mod in without a problem) is the ability to 3-D print special blocks. Like slime or leaf blocks.

Otherwise, the game is fun and a great time killer. I much prefer the art style and block diversity over Terraria. It feels much more... Scenic? Less cartoony, by any means. And I like that.

Neo, I'll be honest. You're so salty about this game you'd ruin many a good steak. It honestly feels like you think this game promised you nirvana then immediately shat on your desk. It didn't do that; it had poor development and the politics and PR surrounding it was bad, but it's not a bad game. It's worth its price and, hey, at least they're still trying at it after all the flak they've gotten. If you ask me, they've definitely matured at least a little bit since LOLHORSE. It's... Weird they decided to instead move to publishing but honestly, the games they're moving to publish all look fun.

[Neonivek]

Gentlefish I particularly remember giving the game a 5/10, that isn't a bad game.

Heck my ultimate complaint was that it needed to be touched up and that my major beef is more people telling me I couldn't complain then with the game itself.

Which frankly... I am getting tired of being told over and over that I can't complain, that I am wrong to complain, or that my opinion on the game is invalid... But alas that is how things go in here. I should just get used to it.

[Scripten]

Heck my ultimate complaint was that it needed to be touched up and that my major beef is more people telling me I couldn't complain then with the game itself.

I tried to ask you what you found wrong with the game and I don't think I ever asked you to stop complaining. I apologize if I came across as trying to shut you down. I'm legitimately curious about the problems you have with the game, even in its current incarnation.

Which frankly... I am getting tired of being told over and over that I can't complain, that I am wrong to complain, or that my opinion on the game is invalid... But alas that is the Starbound defense squad for you.

To be fair, this thread has been something like (at least) forty pages of people slamming the game, the devs, and shutting down gameplay-related conversations like those you see in other thread in Other Games. Not everyone has been doing this, of course. It's just pretty distracting when you want to come discuss the game and there's not really any actual conversation about it in its thread.