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[CaptainArchmage]

Walp. This bodes well.... NOT!

But the monastery is deserted... also statues (sort of) blocking the entrances to the main structure. A load of statues, empty pedestals, and a room with beds in it. Some sort of "coven", actually. I'm sure this is the kind of place where in most games, you'd run into some "evil priests" and end up in combat...

Anybody else get deserted monasteries? Might be losing folks from these places too quickly. Can't have an evil monastery if you sacrifice all the acolytes...

[Orkel]

Boy, I hope loyalty cascades get fixed in the upcoming bugfix patches. I've already lost 3 forts to massive cascades in this version, not to mention the countless cascades in previous versions.

Two of them caused by basic tavern brawls turning into a loyalty cascade with 100+ dead dwarves, and the other caused by a failed mood turning berserk with my military killing eachother because of attacking the berserk dwarf. Saving every month and savescumming each cascade seems to be a requirement right now, otherwise it's impossible to keep a fort longer than a few years.

[Shonai_Dweller]

Boy, I hope loyalty cascades get fixed in the upcoming bugfix patches. I've already lost 3 forts to massive cascades in this version, not to mention the countless cascades in previous versions.

Two of them caused by basic tavern brawls turning into a loyalty cascade with 100+ dead dwarves, and the other caused by a failed mood turning berserk with my military killing eachother because of attacking the berserk dwarf. Saving every month and savescumming each cascade seems to be a requirement right now, otherwise it's impossible to keep a fort longer than a few years.

Post a save somewhere?
Loyalty cascades were fixed years ago.

I know big fights that end up with a bunch of dead dwarves still happen from time to time though. Without a save there's no way of knowing what the cause could be. Regular brawl incorrectly escalating presumably.

[Shonai_Dweller]

In 215 Wipeforked the Clean Riddles was created by the Dwarf Udil Ringflights
In 215 Wipeforked the Clean Riddles was offered to the goblin Ngokang Horrorscraps by the Dwarf Udil Ringflights
In 215 Wipeforked the Clean Riddles was stored in the Tower of Caves by the goblin Ngokang Horrorscapes

In 216 Wipeforked was claimed by the goblin Ngokang Horrorscapes from afar.

That's not right is it?
Wipeforked was claimed by a bunch of other goblins too, but was never stolen until much later in the year 249.
And Ngokang didn't move away anywhere.

[Urlance Woolsbane]

Anybody else get deserted monasteries? Might be losing folks from these places too quickly. Can't have an evil monastery if you sacrifice all the acolytes...

"Bare ruined choirs, where late the sweet birds sang..."
I had a world with plenty of them, but then it was fairly post-apocalyptic, so most sites were deserted. Still, it makes sense that small sites would get abandoned with some regularity.

[Orkel]

I posted this in the Steam update thread but I'll post it here as well:

There are still a lot of old, important bugs to fix. For example:

-Military equipment is erratic, sometimes they only wear 1 boot or 1 gauntlet or are completely missing pieces that are waiting in the stockpile etc, resulting in injuries http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=535
-Traction benches in healthcare causing infinite diagnose loops, and other healthcare issues http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=94
-Loyalty cascades where your entire fort murders eachother because of a drunkard punching someone, or your military murdering eachother because they attacked a berserking dwarf, without a doubt the most game-crippling bug that has happened in every single fort I've played the past few years: http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=11046 http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=7107 http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=11133 http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=10935
-Stress is unbalanced, and the Needs system is unfinished and buggy which causes even more stress (stuff like meal needs and family needs among others are too difficult or impossible to fulfill)
-Weapon balance issues (whips and scourges are like supersonic hammers that make skulls explode through any armor, arrows penetrate everything, and other issues). This is fixable by mods, unlike the other bugs, but it's an annoyance to do every update.

And many others on the bug tracker. Please don't start the 2-3 year long "big wait" before fixing at least some of these crippling issues with the game. Many of the bugs have been in the game for 2-10+ years which is absurd considering how crippling or frustrating they can be.

I don't like "requesting" bug fixes since it feels like pushing the developers, but I also cannot stay silent about this since I've played for years and years with these bugs around and suffer from most of them in every single fort in some way or another.

[George_Chickens]

Large regions seem to be disproportionately crashy in worldgen on Linux, if you put up caves or civilizations. Could another Linux user confirm that it's a repeatable bug and not just my end being odd? Just adding 5 more civs and 50 more caves seems to do it for me.

[Shonai_Dweller]

Large regions seem to be disproportionately crashy in worldgen on Linux, if you put up caves or civilizations. Could another Linux user confirm that it's a repeatable bug and not just my end being odd? Just adding 5 more civs and 50 more caves seems to do it for me.

Large regions are crashing for most people right now.
So much stuff going on makes it easy for whatever is causing worldgen crashes to happen.

[CaptainArchmage]

Anybody else get deserted monasteries? Might be losing folks from these places too quickly. Can't have an evil monastery if you sacrifice all the acolytes...

"Bare ruined choirs, where late the sweet birds sang..."
I had a world with plenty of them, but then it was fairly post-apocalyptic, so most sites were deserted. Still, it makes sense that small sites would get abandoned with some regularity.

That world had a kind of no dwarf's/elf's/human's/goblin's land where there were a lot of elven forest retreats that had been abandoned. I checked and the situation with the monastery was like this:



I feel that if the monastery hasn't been occupied for a while, it should feel... derelict. Not enough strange books and shady folks hanging around there.

Edit: Population as of starting out there was 1 human and 1 human outcast. So nearly a hermitage of sorts. Appropriate, maybe I didn't look hard enough.



Meanwhile, the elven forest retreat of Queenshore (which was far from any shore) lasted from 87 until the year 94, or about 7 years (Boatmurdered, by contrast, lasted for ~13 ish years). It was then overrun by a necromancer who occupied the retreat and carried out terrible experiments. Apparently it was never resettled. This is the year 316 (I stopped worldgen as it was taking a while).

I think at *least* the retreat should have been resettled... just, like, in my view. Or it should have remained occupied by undead...

Also Edit: While the retreat is depicted on the map as ruined it is home to 3 elves and a large menagerie of animals. I get ruined locations can and should still have inhabitants, but... it's not like it's hard to resettle them. Are there any reclaim mechanics for civs in worldgen?

[TomiTapio]

I just found that OldGenesis mod "crash on pressing embark" is caused by our twelve-castes dwarf creature definition.
Using vanilla dwarf creature I was able the remove the crash.

[FantasticDorf]

Very interesting things happening in my legends. One of my mummies conducting a large war was a interred demon lizard who was praying to a death-god. Said death god has been very busy attracting devotion of necromancers (whether actually praying to them makes you one instantly , they're migrating to a friendly religion fort or there were just a lot of apprentices spread out) and cursing folks. This god came about as far as i can see from a overrun 'Minas Tirth' fortress.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

This God has never existed prior in worldgen and became prominent only after it emerged, other gods sometimes unrelated to the negative spheres also are generating religions from the Tirth fortresses. If there's ever a title for a 'Age of Darkness' in the very rough 250 years dipping in and out of Age of Myth and Legend i think this qualifies for the sheer havoc they're wrecking with huge amounts of demons, nightbeasts & cloisters of necromancers being made.

Edit - the armies im reading out seem to be demons migrating from other 'Tirth's' too into a world-stomping fighting force.
Edit 2a - Checking on the activities in the second age, human Ebbak silkysmith destroyed the patron death god's fortress with 2447 'mostly human' soldiers (and a mercenary corp) leading to the death and interrment of the lizard demon, coming full circle.
Edit 2b - Not forgetting the brave sacrifice of the dwarves 200 strong army on the offense and took down 20 demons in the world-stomper army in attempt to reclaim their lost fortress back roughly cutting the danger for Ebbaks's attack in half. Two artifacts were lost in the process on the fields the battle took place on.

XML's and worldgen data here for Toady

[Toady One]

Could you provide a correct list of these unknown positions?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

CUSTOM_LAW_MAKER
CUSTOM_OUTCAST_LT
CUSTOM_OUTCAST_FACTOR
CUSTOM_COMPANY_FACTOR
CUSTOM_COMPANY_LEADER
_LEADER
CUSTOM_BANDIT_LEADER
CUSTOM_MILITARY_GOALS
CUSTOM_MILITARY_STRATEGY
CUSTOM_OFFICIAL_# - answered
CUSTOM_MERCENARY_TREASURER
HIGHEST_PRIEST
CUSTOM_LAW_MAKER_2
WORSHIP_HF
CUSTOM_GUILD_LEADER
CUSTOM_GUILD_CLERK
CUSTOM_GUILD_STEWARD
CUSTOM_GUILD_ALDERPERSON
CUSTOM_MARKET_OFFICIAL_# - answered

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

CUSTOM_LAW_MAKER -- this one is ambiguous currently - law-giver, lord/lady, abbot in monastery, castle baron, master (demon)
CUSTOM_OUTCAST_LT -- lieutenant (bandit/villain)
CUSTOM_OUTCAST_FACTOR -- representative (larger criminal gang)
CUSTOM_COMPANY_FACTOR -- factor/agent/governor/administrator (all the same thing, merchant company)
CUSTOM_COMPANY_LEADER -- master/head (merchant company)
_LEADER -- no idea what this one is, but there is CUSTOM_MERCENARY_LEADER, which has a ton of names and is the head of a mercenary/military order
CUSTOM_BANDIT_LEADER -- master/ringleader etc. of bandits
CUSTOM_MILITARY_GOALS -- war leader
CUSTOM_MILITARY_STRATEGY -- general/marshal/constable
CUSTOM_MERCENARY_TREASURER -- treasurer (of military order)
HIGHEST_PRIEST -- holy city priest for any religion, has random name
CUSTOM_LAW_MAKER_2 -- baron for market castles
WORSHIP_HF -- related to text processing somewhere, not a position
CUSTOM_GUILD_LEADER -- these four are as they say, the positions in the new crafts guilds
CUSTOM_GUILD_CLERK
CUSTOM_GUILD_STEWARD
CUSTOM_GUILD_ALDERPERSON

Incidentally Toady, are seeds better off posted here or over at the tracker? I see a fair few building up over there now.

Oh, just realized. If babies are controlling their mother's like horses, that means the new mount control AI was implemented into Fortress mode, right? So riders decide where to go, like in Adventurer.

So, does that mean the "amphibious mounts drown their riders" bug is now fixed?

FantasticDorf: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=175434.msg8082781#msg8082781

Yeah, I defer to anybody that tested it on the mount question.  I homogenized the code to whatever extent, but didn't test that case.

For the seeds, either way works currently, and sometimes here is good enough, though these threads become more difficult to track over time.

Bingo! With following seeds, the LARGE REGION worldgen consistently crashes at year 60:

Generating world using parameter set LARGE REGION
 Seed: R9icKscYxmcBKRtCCKZJ
 History Seed: hBfG6Elyz8LjyWsrdvla
 Name Seed: qaNwdLLoVokwx80c5tDr
 Creature Seed: 5D3t5tHiFMe444lmE1ej

I got it to reproduce in the released version, and it didn't happen on the next one, so that means it is either fixed or the previous two fixes tweaked the seed enough that it dodges now (and we'll have to get it on another seed after the next release.)  It is hopeful, anyway.

How do you use the party tactics mode? Where you control all the party member's actions, I mean.

Capital E.

I also saw that all of them became Members of the Goblin Civ. They are also members of the normal Dwarven civ too though.

I have just confirmed that all the Kings of my dwarven Civ treat the now conquered Mountainhome as if it still was the Mountainhome. They always move to it if they already weren't living there (they go there even before becoming Kings sometimes, which seems to show that citizens from the Dwarven Civ have freedom of movement inside the conquered city). This is rather weird and I really doubt it isn't a bug.

Hmm.  This is certainly a dubious behavior.  They probably failed to update the position capital link.

Nice fast one for you.

Small region. (Set for 1050 years with Megabeast cutoff of 50 starting at year 250. in case it makes a difference)
Crashes at year 208 (doesn't take long to get there)

 Seed: 2XURWJBNecN0GYWd4vic
 History Seed: FCjdQ4im7tEDMLzDCJho
 Name Seed: lMrVEJzKIF6OQJ3qTJ5F
 Creature Seed: rLU9sCkkiAoJ5SHpmsye

This was different from the other one (this was related to punishing criminals) and is also now fixed for next time.

Just in case it helps, I got a crash on Mac-x64 version when embarking on adventure mode using default world-gen except for switching world size to pocket. I tried again only with a world with a short history instead of medium and the same thing happened.

Fortress mode seems to work fine.

If that means there's a save where you can start in adv mode with a reproducible crash that's definitely useful.  If it's intermittent it'll be harder to find.

In 215 Wipeforked the Clean Riddles was stored in the Tower of Caves by the goblin Ngokang Horrorscapes

In 216 Wipeforked was claimed by the goblin Ngokang Horrorscapes from afar.

That's not right is it?

Hmm, yeah, that's likely a bug, of the kind I'd been trying to get a handle on but apparently have not.  There's often a conflict with personal treasures vs. family heirlooms for instance - sometimes the villains don't recognize that a stored item they claimed for their family is not a treasure to be coveted suddenly, despite code supposedly there to prevent this.

I posted this in the Steam update thread but I'll post it here as well:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

There are still a lot of old, important bugs to fix. For example:

-Military equipment is erratic, sometimes they only wear 1 boot or 1 gauntlet or are completely missing pieces that are waiting in the stockpile etc, resulting in injuries http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=535
-Traction benches in healthcare causing infinite diagnose loops, and other healthcare issues http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=94
-Loyalty cascades where your entire fort murders eachother because of a drunkard punching someone, or your military murdering eachother because they attacked a berserking dwarf, without a doubt the most game-crippling bug that has happened in every single fort I've played the past few years: http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=11046 http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=7107 http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=11133 http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=10935
-Stress is unbalanced, and the Needs system is unfinished and buggy which causes even more stress (stuff like meal needs and family needs among others are too difficult or impossible to fulfill)
-Weapon balance issues (whips and scourges are like supersonic hammers that make skulls explode through any armor, arrows penetrate everything, and other issues). This is fixable by mods, unlike the other bugs, but it's an annoyance to do every update.

And many others on the bug tracker. Please don't start the 2-3 year long "big wait" before fixing at least some of these crippling issues with the game. Many of the bugs have been in the game for 2-10+ years which is absurd considering how crippling or frustrating they can be.

I don't like "requesting" bug fixes since it feels like pushing the developers, but I also cannot stay silent about this since I've played for years and years with these bugs around and suffer from most of them in every single fort in some way or another.

Certainly going to fix a lot of old stuff before the Steam release, nevermind the Big Wait.  A lot of this will happen during the parallel release cycle I've mentioned - that isn't just about fixing weapon-trap style crashes that pop up, but getting bugs cleaned generally.

I think at *least* the retreat should have been resettled... just, like, in my view. Or it should have remained occupied by undead...

Also Edit: While the retreat is depicted on the map as ruined it is home to 3 elves and a large menagerie of animals. I get ruined locations can and should still have inhabitants, but... it's not like it's hard to resettle them. Are there any reclaim mechanics for civs in worldgen?

Did it say who they were or if they had an entity?  Occasionally monasteries and other places become home to bandits, I think, which then, I think, stops the resettlement code from retriggering and they don't know how to "clear them out", which they should do more often.

I just found that OldGenesis mod "crash on pressing embark" is caused by our twelve-castes dwarf creature definition.
Using vanilla dwarf creature I was able the remove the crash.

Hmm, I don't have any immediate ideas as to why that should cause a new problem.  Is the mod on the tracker now?

[ZM5]

There appears to be a crash issue with outsiders in adventure mode - wasn't able to spawn in a town civ as one - some other users seem to be having a similar issue with other sites as well. Still on the 30 year old world I was able to generate.

Also while I guess this is unintended its also kind of awesome - outsiders get a pet list containing every pet or pet_exotic creature, including megabeasts (red dragon in this particular image). No way to increase the points for now but ofc the amount of points required to buy these could be reduced to have megabeasts. Sadly unable to see effects beyond that given the crash issue.

[Shonai_Dweller]

Are castles actually working?
I've not spotted one yet. They should appear in Legends Mode "Sites", right?

7025 sites in my current Medium region world. No castle. Monastery spam across the land though.

[Rumrusher]

wondering if setting the world gen stop rate to earlier would have any affect on the speed necromancers would experiment, or is there a fix but Extremely Long rate necromancers and demons would take to start pumping out experiments. knowing what year would be perfect to stop at could help cut down on the slow process of generating longer worlds.
so far from my experience stopping the game around 120 would produce results but depending on the world size that might take a while to load in.